Random Curiosity

Naruto 588 – We Are The Kages »« Naruto 586 – Your Destiny Is In My Hands

Naruto 587 – Izanami To Your Izanagi

I knew I could count on you Kishimoto! Ol’ buddy, ol’ pal, ol’ friend of mine! Okay false illusions of friendships with famous mangaka aside, you’ll remember there were quite a bit of loose ends/questions left over following last week’s chapter. And well, Kishimoto takes the time to answer virtually every single one of them.

First off, the question of how Izanami works. It took a little bit of effort to decipher all those A and A’ diagrams, but I believe I got the hang of how it works. I’m still not completely sure though, so take this with a grain of salt.

  • First, it takes two reference points A and A’. Say you threw an object and it landed on the floor. The act of you throwing the object is A and you visualizing the object landing on the floor is A’.
  • The technique then overlaps/links these events together to set the duration of the loop, thus making the target continuously relive the same moment of throwing the object and watching it land.
  • Finally, it repeats this overlapping on a smaller scale in the moments between A and A’. Sounds a bit convoluted, but it pretty much just means that in between the time you threw the object and watch it land, there are other things that happen in between. But, because you’re still within the same loop, no matter what you do in between A and A’, it will always end up being the same result.
  • Next, why was Izanami a Kinjutsu? And what was it used for in the first place? Amazingly enough, the end result is that it’s not a kinjutsu because it was too powerful. Rather, it’s because of the threats it posed to the person using the technique and to the completion of their mission. It makes sense in a way, as well as how it’s an ideal counter to the Izanagi technique… but this explanation does bug me a little. I mean, I understand how it would make someone arrogant and so forth, but isn’t the Izanagi technique supposed to blind one of the user’s eyes? Thus, wouldn’t it limit the amount of times it could be used in the first place and prevent the technique from being overused? Furthermore, with Izanami also causing the inability to use one’s eye, wouldn’t that also limit the people willing to use this technique to punish the Izanagi users? I mean, unless everyone was busy transplanting eyes into each other back then (even then I’m not sure this would restore one’s vision), I don’t see how the Izanagi and Izanami techniques could have been used on such a daily basis.

    In any case, I suppose the above explanations were adequate… but they do seem a little bit “meh” at the same time. Furthermore, it’s notable how many people managed to predict most of the answers last week already. I did like how Kishimoto linked Kabuto’s flashback to his current trials with Izanami though. And for that, I must apologize for being a bit too harsh on the sudden flashbacks of the last few chapters, as they turned out to be pretty influential in how things worked out with Izanami. Another thing I wanted to note was how Sasuke and Itachi finally get their much needed talk in. I was half expecting Itachi not to bother or that something’ll happen before he could have the discussion, but it seems like that was not to be. In turn, we get quite a look into Itachi’s character, and really, it makes me feel for the guy. Dealt a crappy hand by how circumstances worked out in his life, he still managed to persevere and live on. It took him dying and getting revived by Edo Tensei to actually spit this out, but hey, he did it, and he’s amazingly developed into one of the more deeper characters of the series.

    Looking forward, it seems like Itachi will most likely deactivate the Edo Tensei next chapter… unless the focus shifts back to the fights between the Kage or the plan doesn’t quite go according to plan. I don’t see the latter happening at this point, but I won’t say it’s an impossibility. Regardless, the main thing to look for in the future though (especially after this chapter), is the effect of Itachi on Sasuke and his future actions. He now knows quite a bit about the Izanagi technique, potentially how to use Izanami, as well as the fact that he’s mis-understood Itachi to a degree. I suspect he’ll end up fighting Naruto no matter what happens, but this’ll definitely influence the result of that fight and the success of the “Eye of the Moon Plan” too. And well, I guess we’ll see how things work out. :D

    May 23, 2012 at 10:12 am
    • May 23, 2012 at 10:22 amsh0yu

      izanami isn’t that impressive…meh

    • May 23, 2012 at 10:32 amYanDaMan

      Well I’m glad my guess was correct for the most part last week on how to break Izanami you just have to accept yourself.

      As far as Itachi cancelling Edo Tensei, wouldn’t that mean we wont see the results of the Kage fights since Madara will just go kaplut? I hope that dont actually happen and we see more action (maybe their fight and Kabuto’s fight were happening in parallels).

      This also means all the jinchuuriki’s will go poof, what will happen to Naruto “saving” them all? Either way if Edo Tensei gets canceld, it’ll just be Tobi all by himself, forever alone in the war lol.

      • May 23, 2012 at 10:41 amMasterDragonKnight

        Except Naruto and Gaara, all of the other Jinchuuriki are dead. What Naruto promised to save are the tailed-beasts.

        The hosts have just left a little of their consciousness with the tailed-beasts, allowing them one last conversation with Naruto and leaving their wills with him.

        • May 23, 2012 at 12:03 pml3reezer

          What’s going on with the Naruto fan base. The two comments before me have a dislike for no apparent reason, haha.

      • May 23, 2012 at 8:06 pmhaem

        Didn’t Kabuto teach edo tensei to Tobi? Show Spoiler ▼

        • May 24, 2012 at 12:50 amgawrshness

          Wait a minute…I wonder that’s how Madara will stay in the fray, cause with all the hype Kishi built bringing Madara into the battlefield killing him off with just one technique being deactivated would be MAJORLY anti-climactic

        • May 24, 2012 at 8:01 pmPlatue

          Tobi would need some of Madara’s DNA o revive him again. And, no he could not get DNA from Madara now because that’s not his body that he is in.

        • May 24, 2012 at 10:02 pmhaem

          Well. . I mean, its all guesses but Show Spoiler ▼

    • May 23, 2012 at 10:44 amMasterDragonKnight

      Hopefully, with Itachi’s speech, Sasuke will no longer have a reason to try and destroy the village.

      No more Emo-suke please.

      • May 23, 2012 at 1:25 pmzero hour

        you would think that but you know sasuke will keep blaming konoha because how itachi had to live and what he was forced to do. Plus his hatred for konoha must remain so that he can fight naruto in the epic battle of the century that kishimoto has been building them both up for.

    • May 23, 2012 at 11:42 amJustinnnnnn

      People wanted their explanatory charts, and Kishimoto delivered ‘em, lol.

      Phew, we are finally ending with this Kabuto fight *prays everything goes according to plan next week*. Switch back to Naruto! I want the main hero and his demon fox mascot to kick ass.

    • May 23, 2012 at 12:34 pmBashira

      How come those leaf shinobi at the end were wearing the leaf headbands? I thought everyone in the alliance wore the “shinobi” headband?

      • May 23, 2012 at 12:50 pmZephyr

        I believe it was a flashback of one of Kabuto’s old missions.

        • May 23, 2012 at 12:53 pmBashira

          Ohh I see. Yeah all their talk about “the war” threw me off :P

        • May 23, 2012 at 12:55 pmBashira

          Oh wait, but on one panel he says “and if when the war ends the 5 countries are still friends..” :S

        • May 23, 2012 at 3:37 pmZephyr

          Oh yeah… no wonder something struck me as odd about that scene. I didn’t catch the leaf thing though. Good catch good sir! :D

      • May 23, 2012 at 1:55 pmJustinnnnnn

        Nice find, Bashira!

      • May 23, 2012 at 2:13 pmMasterDragonKnight

        That is a nice catch.

        I also thought that these two are taking part in the current war. The person offering a place to stay is one of the orphans as an adult, still waiting for the return of Kabuto.

        So either it is a flashback, or Kishimoto accidentally slipped up.

      • May 24, 2012 at 5:59 amSharingod

        Another possibility is since they are the lower level shinobi, they aren’t actively participating in the war? So no joint headband for them? Just a guess

    • May 23, 2012 at 1:21 pmInfinite

      Edo Tensei won’t end, otherwise the 2 idiots wouldn’t have stumbled upon that hidden hideout and Madara to suddenly crumble away would be completely pointless.

    • May 23, 2012 at 1:34 pmzero hour

      Edo Tensei ending will bring pros and cons. It will get ride of regenerating zombies and most importantly Super Ninja Madara. The kages aren’t going to beat him no matter how much smack they talk. The con is that Tobi will get desperate and more violent once this occurs. I think he will end up killing Bee to get his beast. I’m not sure what will happen with Naruto but he might die too only for Tsunade to give her life to bring him back. The Ten Tails will be reincarnated, it will be the one thing that makes Sasuke and Naruto fight side by side once again.

      • May 24, 2012 at 8:07 pmPlatue

        People are forgetting that Edo Tensei is something that Kabuto brought to the fight. Tobi had planned this war without Edo Tensei. So even after it ends, he still has other things up his sleeve.

    • May 23, 2012 at 1:53 pmRyougaZell

      Two words. to resume all the explanation: Eternal Loop.

      There… everything Kishimoto said in half a chapter resumed in two simple words.

      • May 23, 2012 at 2:14 pmMasterDragonKnight

        Two more accurate words would be: Endless Eight

        There is technically a way to escape the loop, but they must do something different.

        • May 25, 2012 at 6:44 amRyougaZell

          Oh god… you just had to say that. I had finally managed to forget ‘that’ happened.

    • May 23, 2012 at 3:23 pmLoL


    • May 23, 2012 at 4:08 pmronri

      I thought that was actually a good chapter. Not bad, not great, it just ran smoothly. :)

    • May 23, 2012 at 4:55 pmFullmetal

      The fact that Izanami is used to punish Izanagi users doesn’t make much sense. For example, if Sasuke had used Izanami on Danzou, would that mean he had to chose between dying by Susanoo’s attacks or being in the endless loop?

      • May 23, 2012 at 5:06 pmZephyr

        It seems to me that the original punishment was meant to keep the person in the eternal loop until he/she accepted the future that came from Izanagi, hence punishment.

        The latter part about Sasuke vs. Danzou… Danzou could have broken out of the endless loop by accepting whatever it was that he feared. Hence Danzou could’ve just potentially shaken off the attack and resumed the fight with Sasuke, who would’ve then been weakened immensely due to the fact he’d lose an eye. Most likely Sasuke would have lost then and it’s exactly why this technique was forbidden, because it might allow a scenario where the opponent may survive and the mission be unfulfilled. Izanagi would be a more proper technique to use. Basically, Izanami’s only used in this case to lock Kabuto in order for Itachi to undo the Edo Tensei somehow. It’s not normally used at all, especially when you have Izanagi as an alternate, more powerful tech.

        • May 23, 2012 at 5:23 pmFullmetal

          I think so, but it is still unclear what “acceptance” releases you from Izanami: accepting your fear, your destiny, your trueself, the path you were supposed to follow but changed with Izanagi, your true feelings? I mean, you can accept many things about yourself, which you had previously denied or forgotten.

        • May 24, 2012 at 3:22 pmZephyr

          True. It seems like it’s what’s the most pressing thing on the person’s mind at that moment though… so if you just did Izanagi, then that would be for punishment… Kabuto’s is accepting himself because everything up to now has been due to him not doing so… etc. I reckon we’ll see it again at some point though. Maybe.

        • May 24, 2012 at 8:19 pmPlatue

          I think your looking at “punishment” in the wrong way. Izanami is not ment to hurt someone but to save them by teaching them a lesson. Itachi is not trying to kill Kabuto with Izanami, he’s teaching him a lesson to save him.
          I soo can’t wait to see how Izanami was involved in Madara’s true back story.

    • May 23, 2012 at 5:50 pmEnder905

      Izanami requires no eye contact with the sharingan user, hence a genjutsu that can be used anytime; adding to its (limited) usefulness.

    • May 23, 2012 at 6:22 pmrandom viewer

      If Tobi/Madara decides to use Izanagi, then Sasuke will know its weakness…Izanami.
      I wonder after releasing the Edo Tensei will Kabuto be killed so that he won’t use it again.
      But even if after that, Kabuto already showed Tobi how Edo Tensei works before so he can use it.
      And that’s all the talk there was between the brothers? I expected a whole chapter after they deal with Kabuto.

    • May 23, 2012 at 11:31 pmWill

      ….. They should just get back to blowing stuff up and fighting with meteors. enough with the over complicated illusions.

    • May 24, 2012 at 4:56 amkarice67

      First, it takes two reference points A and A’. Say you threw an object and it landed on the floor. The act of you throwing the object is A and you visualizing the object landing on the floor is A’.

      Hm…isn’t it more that A’ is a repetition of A?

      I.e. A = you throw an object at someone

      Then, you repeat this some time later, i.e., once again, you throw the object at the same person (= A’).

      The overlapping of these two actions (A and A’) that are experienced the same way makes the time loop, and any other action/event in between that the body remembers (B, C etc) also becomes part of that loop.

      • May 24, 2012 at 8:24 pmPlatue

        Every time Kabuto’s horn was cut off it fell to the ground. Each past horn was also still laying on the ground, so it’s not as simple as looping video. It’s not that he is reliving the same events it’s that the same events keep repeating.

        • May 24, 2012 at 8:47 pmkarice67

          Good point – I didn’t catch that. So rather than a time loop, just a never-ending repetition of A/A’ and some of the actions that occurred in between…

    • May 24, 2012 at 10:27 amHalfDemonInuyasha

      Well, a Sharingan-user using Izanagi has already shown to be an imperfect technique as it is while a Rinnegan-user using Izanagi would have a perfected and more powerful version, as explained by Tobi, so who knows if Izanami could actually work if the undead Madara were to use it given he’d now have the perfected version (literally creating something from nothing and all that).

      As for ending Edo Tensei and Madara, considering Madara has the Rinnegan AND the power of both the Senju and Uchiha in him (essentially making him a “true” successor to the Rikudo Sennin now), it certainly wouldn’t be surprising if he pulled some kind of hax jutsu with the Rinnegan and somehow bypass crumbling away should it happen.

      • May 25, 2012 at 1:51 amZero Hour 17

        I have a very strong feeling that it won’t be ending yet. atleast not until The Kages prove their strength to Madara. I doubt they will end it with the Kages looking so weak. I’m betting it will switch back to that and we’ll see them beat and seal Madara over the next couple chapters

      • May 25, 2012 at 2:37 amT_T

        i bet he ll use the Rinnegan Izanagi and Izanami to make a real body n transfer hes soul into hes new body

    • May 24, 2012 at 11:13 amJoe

      We have Izanagi, Izanami, Amaterasu, Tsukuyomi, and Susanoo. Where is the leech child?

    • May 24, 2012 at 7:00 pmHalfDemonInuyasha

      Another thing…considering Edo Tensei’s properties (it has not been shut down yet)…shouldn’t Itachi’s blind eye end up regenerated and not stay blinded?

      Unless it’s like Izanagi and completely sacrifices the eye in some way that makes it unable to do so, but shown a different way (considering Izanagi literally closes off that eye for good while Izanami seems to be just blindness).

      • May 24, 2012 at 8:35 pmFullmetal

        If something I’ve learned from Naruto, is that medical issues are to be considered unrealistic. Considering all sorts of cases in which medicine has been defied tremendously, you can expect anything. For instance, a shuriken can kill Danzou (forcing him to uses izanagi a few times), but Kakashi tearing apart Deidara’s arm with mangekyou sharingan only results in small blood loss xD.

    • May 25, 2012 at 1:48 amZero Hour 17

      all a person would need is 1 extra eye to be able to use Izanagi forever. Let’s say you had your 2 eyes and 1 in your hand. You can use Izanagi in once per eye in your head, then the one in your hand to make the fact that you lost vision in both of your eyes an illusion. From then on you can use Izanagi once on your enemy, then the other to restore 2 eyes, allowing you to loop it forever, as long as you dont mess up and use it twice on your enemy.

    • May 25, 2012 at 2:04 amAbyss

      Naruto with the 9 tails mode vs Sasuke with EMS aka with Izanagi, Izanami, Amaterasu, Tsukuyomi, and Susanoo.

      Now the question: who will win?

      • May 25, 2012 at 2:41 amT_T

        naruto cuz he can accept who he is and whatnot thats the appearntly way 2 break Izanami he can dodge Amaterasu 9tail can break Tsukuyomi Susanoo can b broken with sheer power dunno about Izanagi

        • May 25, 2012 at 3:17 amAbyss

          If I undestand the power of the EMS and all the jutsus of the Magenkyo don’t cause blindness to his user, if Sasugay can use Izanami, Izanagi, Amaterasu, Susanoo and Tsukiyomi as long he have chakra, Naruto is so fucked.

          I accept the Naruto’s resistance to Izanami, but a good combination of Izanagi, Susanoo, Amaterasu or Tsukiyomi and the rival is dead.

          Izanagi is the best Evasion, and Naruto lack the Izanami obviously, his speed and strenght are futile.
          Amaterasu is the best Attack, and Naruto have not a single defensive jutsu.
          Tsukiyomi is the best Ilusion attack, and now I don’t remember if Bee free himself from a Genjutsu or the Tsukiyomi….
          Susanoo is the best Defense, and if is similar to Itachi’s Susanoo, the best general jutsu, with defense, short attack, long attack and a lot of speed attack.

          By the way, I doubt that Itachi break the Edo Tensei, Kabuto will win this battle, kill or possess Itachi? I don’t know, but Suigetsu and the other guy found some information from Orochimaru’s base and they will give that to Sasugay, some information for “control this war”.

          My money is on Kabuto who will be murdered by Tobi or Madara, overconfident after won over two Magenkyo Uchihas

        • May 25, 2012 at 12:05 pmHalfDemonInuyasha

          I actually don’t think an Eternal Mangekyo Sharingan would be immune to the downside of Izanagi.

          Looking at what happened with Danzo and Tobi using it, despite being normal Sharingan, Izanagi does NOT cause mere blindness, but actually forcefully and permanently closes off the used eye for good, sacrificing the entire eye as a result, thus an even WORSE way of “losing one’s light” than mere blindness, and ends up requiring Tobi to replace it (which is why he kept it behind the mask and constantly “without light” as it is) and for Danzo to require so many of them for each subsequent use.

      • May 25, 2012 at 3:39 amSharingod

        I’m only going to say that since Izanagi (and probably izanami) is not a jutsu that you have to have the mangekyo sharingan to use (looking at danzo), its not certain having the eternal mangekyo will prevent you from being blind by using it.

      • May 26, 2012 at 12:39 amT_T

        Amaterasu is the best Attack it maybe hes best attack its usless if is donest make contact u cant really say ems can spam Izanami and Izanagi endless since donzo has senju blood in him n all hes other eye had 2 b closed up and yes 8tail helped bee break Tsukiyomi and no susuke is not like Itachi Susanoo becuz its missing 2 important items the sword n the shield even tsunade mange 2 break madra Susanoo