First Impressions / Macross

Summary:

Many years ago, when Ranka was still young, she had been in a lab when her mother and Grace had been arguing about Grace’s plan to sacrifice something. Grace had wanted to change the world by combining her implant network theory with the Vajra’s zero-time Fold communications, and when Ranshe tried to protest but ended up coughing instead, Grace had questioned why Ranshe protected the Vajra to the point that she became so sick. Right after young Ranka realizes that she’s sitting beside a boy, she wakes up to Brera’s voice telling her that they’ve arrived at their destination. Meanwhile, on the Macross Frontier, Leon reassures some men that their journey will end soon with the best of goals. For the time being, the government is having all civilians carry around oxygen masks due to the low partial pressure of oxygen. Alto is at this moment flying a patrol around one of the abandoned islands, thinking about how fragile the vessels are and how he had felt that they were inescapable cages. He later meets with Sheryl for dinner, and she insists on them having a toast. Sheryl then gulps down a glass of wine and reveals that being like this has always been her dream. She makes Alto carry her to bed after she’s finished eating the food he cooked, and while she’s in his arms, she asks him not to go home and to always stay by her side. As Alto watches her sleep, he notes that she hasn’t been acting herself, but after seeing the bottle of pills on her nightstand, he wonders if it’s understandable.

Back at the alien planet, Ranka thanks Brera for going along with her selfish request, so he explains that, for a cyborg with no memories, orders are absolute. His raison d’être was to carry out those orders, but when he heard Ranka’s song, something overflowed inside of him, and doing all this is his thanks for that. Brera talks about how Aimo is the only memory he has, but before their conversation about it can continue any further, hundreds of Vajra suddenly de-Fold. Ranka sings Aimo to keep the Vajra at bay, and when Brera joins her with his harmonica, she’s reminded of her past with her mother and the boy who she still doesn’t recognize. Afterwards, Brera gives her his harmonica as a charm so that her wish is realized. Their moment together is short-lived though because the Vajra suddenly attack. Alto meanwhile gets called to a meeting with Leon and Richard Birla, and Leon reports the detection of a faint Fold wave. They’ve confirmed that it was from Ranka singing, and it has allowed them to finally figure out the location of the Vajra homeworld. Alto is ready to fight, but first he wants to know if the purpose of it is to obtain Fold Quartz, so Birla explains that the Vajra just have a habit of collecting raw Fold Quartz materials. Leon notes though that their goal as humans is primarily to survive, and for the future of humanity, they need to destroy the Vajra. He claims that this is because the Vajra are trying to obliterate mankind, and he surprises Alto by stating that the Vajra are using Ranka.

Leon continues by explaining that the Vajra don’t have brains – instead, they communicate with Fold waves via a network of enterobacteria. Each Vajra acts like a synapse, and they have no notion of individuality, so they behave as one swarm. When Alto tries to point out that Ranka’s song affects the Vajra, Leon wonders if Alto has thought about why that’s possible. Leon knows that those bacteria don’t live in human intestines and in fact bring death to humans. The only exception he can think of is if a child were infected while in the womb, and that would mean that a coexistence with the Vajra was chosen. Leon finishes by suggesting that Ranka connects them to the Vajra and that she will become the vanguard who can destroy them. Back in the space around the Vajra planet, Brera tries to reassure Ranka by promising to protect her, but she doesn’t want more fighting. Ranka gets out of the Valkyries’ cockpit after seeing Ai-kun nearby, but it turns out to be a trap, and as she’s getting carried away, Ranka realizes that Brera is her brother. Brera tries his best to give chase, but he’s first held up by the Vajra and then by Grace in her Valkyrie. Grace questions if he had fun escaping with his little sister – which Brera is shocked to hear – before she decides that the magical times are over and activates his slave mode.

While this is going on, over at the hospital on the Frontier, Luca tries to convince Sheryl to take her medicine because it will delay the progression of her illness. Sheryl refuses and points out that no medicine means that her power will become stronger. She feels that if they are going to use her as a tool, then they should be thoroughly cruel to her because kindness is a sin. Alto isn’t part of this discussion, but he is also at the hospital and happens to see his father being pushed away in a wheelchair. Yasaburo is there as well, and as they watch Ranzou being helped into a car, Alto comments on how small his father seems. In response, Yasaburo notes that Alto’s changed if he sees it that way, and he once again requests that Alto return home. Alto claims that he can’t because he’s a pilot in the military, so Yasaburo questions if fighting and killing is really the path that Alto desires. Yasaburo wonders if Alto would have become a pilot regardless of whether or not there was an enemy, and he suggests that Alto is an actor at heart who acts whatever roles he wants. Before leaving, Yasaburo asks Alto to think about what he wants and why, and Alto ends up spending his afternoon thinking about Ranka. At that moment, she is being held on the Vajra planet and realizes that everything that happened to the 117th research fleet was her fault. From her Valkyrie, Grace is watching Ranka during all this and starts to get excited about what she calls the opening of the door to the abyss.

Back on the Frontier, Alto talks with Kuran about how far he’s come, and he asks her why she joined the S.M.S. Kuran tells him that it’s a tradition in her family to become a soldier, so there was no question that she’d do it. Alto explains that he felt the same way about acting, but he yearned for the sky and left home to become a pilot. That’s how he met Ranka, and in order to protect her, he chose to join the S.M.S. Alto concedes that he might have been running away up until now, pretending not to notice various things, but he feels that that’s over. Taking into account how everyone on the Frontier wants to continue living there, Alto declares that if Ranka is made a tool of the Vajra, then he’ll kill her. Hearing this causes Kuran to wonder if that is Alto’s love. Unbeknownst to either of them, Sheryl had been eavesdropping on their conversation, and after she sheds a tear over it, she quietly tells herself that even though she understood, she still wants a little longer. Her thoughts are interrupted by an announcement from the government about an impending Fold jump. Leon plans to head to the Vajra homeworld – which he refers to as their promised land – and he feels that this begins the holy war. Sheryl meanwhile tries to fly a paper airplane that she made, and although it soars up at first, it soon tumbles out of the sky.

Preview

Ouch, having that paper airplane fall out of the sky to end the episode is rather ominous. Add that to how much it probably hurts as well to overhear Alto say that everything he did was for Ranka and that he would kill Ranka if she were used as a tool of the Vajra (which Kuran thinks is his love) – things just can’t go right for her. The problem is that Sheryl really doesn’t have many good options or paths. At this point, she looks likely to die from the bacteria in her, so either she goes out as a hero (via her song rallying the people or saving the day or something), or there’s some miraculous cure found from the Vajra or Grace. Part of this also depends on if Alto loves her more or Ranka more, and despite what happened this episode, I think it’s still up in the air. Heck, Alto swings back and forth between the girls so much that I’m leaning more and more towards the idea that he won’t end up with either of them.

As for the other stuff in the episode, they didn’t talk about Protoculture this week like I thought they would, but a lot of the background was explained, including (kind of) what Grace is after. The whole Vajra hivemind thing reminded more of the zerg than bees, but that may just be me. What I found interesting was that Ranshe seemed to side with the Vajra by choice – compared to Grace who just wants to do whatever is beneficial for herself – so there are still some missing pieces in the past, including Ranshe’s motivations and where Dr. Mao Nome was during all that. On that note, I’m certainly expecting a few more big surprises in the final two episodes and am curious to seeing how this all concludes.

263 Comments

  1. Sherylx Alto FTW:
    Sheryl (drunk while being carried by Alto to bed): “Don’t leave. Always stay by my side.”
    Ranka (while being captured by Vajra again): “Onii-channnnnn!”
    Brera: “My little sister, you say?! Ranka?!”
    Alto: “I will kill Ranka.”

    nycs
    Reply

  3. liked it, was better then one before… also man he better end up with someone, or make it a meaning full dramatic ending, cause if not all that stuff about love triangle in all the episode before would be useless… i think if he doesn’t end up with someone it will be something like macross zero

    Chimasternmay
    Reply

  9. If Alto will be pair up with Ranka in the end after Sheryl singing to protect the people of Frontier and die. I would hate all of it, not because I like Sheryl but it seem too painful for Sheryl when she more focus on protecting people by her voice rather than sing for just 1 person and join SMS for 1 person.

    AsPHERE
    Reply

  11. I’m just wondering, but what if Ranka mother’s mind was joined to the vajra as we seen her in ep 14, as well as it could explain why the vajra react to Aimo. Aimo could be a song that reminds Mei of her former self and could explain why they halt in their attacks.

    Even with Klans’ words of wisdom, I presume that Alto will end up with no one.

    Cherubium
    Reply

  12. So in the end Alto-hime chose volk and fatherland. Sorry Ranka but next time you see Alto-hime will be at the end of his gun barrel. Don’t worry though hime loves Ranka so much he is willing to blow her up for the sake of the fleet. Poor Sheryl at least she got to live with Alto-hime before she dies, glad that she focused on her duty instead of her own pain. Ranka will be loved explosively, but Sheryl is clearly the woman of the triangle. Alto-hime finally became an adult and chose to do his duty before anything else, and now he has his own vic complete with a Kakizaki. Sheryl and Alto-hime living together was great.

    Well I guess Ranka is gong to need a new rescuer since she ended up as the damsel in distress again…Go Ai-kun the jealous little bug snatched Ranka away from Brera in record time!

    Such a pity Grace was not in a pilot suit this time though she beat Brera. I cannot wait to see what Grace has planned for Ranka. Grace Taisa is love!

    Crusader
    Reply

  14. Its a AltoXRanka ending i guess. The way the place sheryl in the picture now seems like its all for preparation for her not to be with alto. Next episode would probably be about Sheryl telling Alto to go and find Ranka while she stays on to sing.

    Sheryl <3

    s.a
    Reply

  16. This is something completely off topic but its been bothering me for a while. Do people here post before or after watching the episode? I watched it already around 4-5ish, so I’m certainly of the latter.

    nycs
    Reply

  17. looks like it will all lead up to a pretty bid ending. I still am rooting for sheryxalto but I just want to see a good ending for the anime in general.

    but as for the episode, looks like ranka’s past is a little bit more revealed. As for the whole Ranka being the “purpose” of alto joining SMS and his dedication to killing her if she is to be with the vajra could either be a sign of love or just a sign of friendship. could work wither way.

    marvin
    Reply

  18. Actually, all this talk of ranka makes me think that it will be an AltoxSheryl end.

    Just like in the original series where it looked like it was going to be minmay right up until the last minute, but thank god it wasn’t out of place like the ichigo 100% ending.

    gundamjehutykai
    Reply

  19. Well, that proves three things:

    1) Sheryl SUCKS at folding paper planes. No wonder it fell down… and maybe this reflects her talents as a pilot. Or that she’s dead woman walking.

    2) Klein and Alto go on another daito… which puts her another date above Sheryl, much less Ranka. If this was a dating sim, Klein would have a LOT of points built up with Alto. Since this is Macross, it just means that Alto listens to Klein, which is probably why she stuck around last week instead of joining the merry band of privateers.

    3) Ranka is SO dead if Alto was serious about killing her if she’s becoming a Vajra tool. I guess Kawamori is busy trolling the shippers who want a Ranka x Alto ending, when Alto’s possibly going to go the Mylene “I’m not picking anyone.. yet” route.

    Plus, Grace is so bloody hot when she’s being evil. Wish she’d had more time on this episode, but won’t complain. Let’s see how Ranka deals with the Vajra, now she’s tuned in directly to their network.

    Haesslich
    Reply

  21. @Haesslich
    Ranshe turned out to be a wet blanket that could not fend of Grace when she was just a scientist, I hope Ranka inherited a bit of courage and spine from her father, because if Ranshe is any indication…well Grace is not taisa for nothing. If Ranka is still in need of rescue she has little hope when Grace takes off the gloves… Still Grace is nevertheless very awesome and evil, hopefuylly we shall see her in a pilot suit again.

    Sheryl’s plane was made of beat up paper, but Sheryl Nome will bravely do her duty for volk and fatherland! She will defend the fatherland until death! Honor and blood for the Northern Cross!

    Crusader
    Reply

  24. Ranka ambiguously left Frontier in 21 because she wanted to end the war with the vajra and human. She wanted the fighting to stop. Thank you episode 23. Thank you lol Now for all the people who blindly accused her of being selfish, I respectfully ask you to….eat your words. ^__^

    And gee, Alto….he surprised me. I may have underestimated his density. 🙁 That was a truly nice scene of Klan and Alto. I loved all Alto’s flashbacks of Ranka and the way he said, “And then I met her…” LOL For Alto to make that much sacrifice for everyone’s sake is very mature. Although, I still think he won’t be able to do it. With Leon and Bilrer as his advicee and his feelings like that, we’re in for a reversal. Besides, looking at Ranka’s wish and the twisted turn of events….Everything is just so tangled up now that the best way to end things is to untangle it (while going dokunx3 =P).

    ani_d
    Reply

  25. Alto’s character development is a disappointment. Throughout the 23 episodes he acted just like a teenager with angst. There isn’t much growth in his character. The girls’ development are much better.

    harby
    Reply

  31. Vajra are likened to synapses of a one functioning brain? I have a suspicion that the Galaxy officials will never be touched upon in the last two episodes. They may have an open ending because of this for a possible continuation.

    @koyuki
    But they called Macross Frontier “Super Galactic Love Story”. Macross 7 is just…I don’t know what it’s promo line but it isn’t really about a love story. Alto will end up with one of the girls and get a happy ending. I can still remember how the traumatic tension in episode 12 was resolved by something terribly silly.

    shan
    Reply

  34. Prediction:

    We’ll have a Battlestar Galactica-esque ending, where all the major characters die (Ranka, Sheryl,Ozma, Alto etc.)

    I actually want it that way, I love Tomino style endings!

    Mechwarrior
    Reply

  36. Both Sheryl and Alto are selfish people.
    They are both quite annoying actually.
    I wouldn’t mind Sheryl dying … even after deciding to sing for ‘the people’ (Yeah right) …. her deciding to sing despite the fact that she knows it’s killing her, is simply a decision born out of selfishness. She has nothing but singing, and to be put in the same category that Ranka was once in (the hope of Macross) … well … there isn’t any other better way to die than to die that way.
    I have never been a Sheryl fan … from the moment she tried to wedge her way between the connection that Ranka and Alto had … I extremely find her annoying.
    Then as the anime progressed … Alto’s indecisiveness just puts him in the same group as Sheryl.
    Kill Ranka …. Bull! …. He will have to go through thousands of Vajra as well as the indestructible Brera-san …. Then again … it may actually happen only if Ranka consents to it. 😛 Bleh

    Dokushaku
    Reply

  37. @ Shan
    They should rename it as ‘Super Headache Inducing Love Triangle’ instead. lol. No offense.

    I still am holding out for a Alto/Ranka end since this has been my fave pairing since Ep 1 but it’s difficult for me to see him with either one of the girls now. Until he gets his feelings sorted out and his priorities straight, he doesn’t deserve either girl.

    What I like about this episode is the Ranshe, Ranka and Brera past.

    koyuki
    Reply

  38. Next episode will be battle heavy thankfully. This week’s wasn’t very good ;_; Alto…sorta hoping the “gets no one route”. Sheryl’s gonna die. That is inevitable. She knows it and we know it. It is just when. And by how annoying she was this episode kinda expecting soon.(acting girly, speaking politely and getting drunk? even Alto knew you hit rock bottom)I’m still thinking this is going to end up being one of Shoji Kawamori’s no one is the bad guy endings like Earth Girl Arjuna for some reason o_O;

    Naru
    Reply

  39. I haven’t seen he episode yet, waiting for the subs ^^
    Still, my general overview is that Alto really chose Frontier…He was always looking for a limitless sky elsewhere, but realized that ‘his’ sky was Frontier’s.
    As for the Love triangle *sigh* it’s getting really frustrating, we might really get an Altox…or so it would seem but I don’t think so, since the fans would riot Macross’ Frontier studios if it happened, except if they make such a conclusive and satisfying ending that everyone will settle with it.
    As I said, I didn’t watch the episode yet so I can’t perfectly say but I believe the ‘winner’ of the Love triangle was still not determined: Alto cares for both girls in his own way and seems to ‘love’ both…? One he would kill, the other he would stay with until she dies ^^;;;

    Sherry
    Reply

  41. @Dokushaku:

    Maybe you should pay attention for once, Sheryl have a type-V infection on final stages and singing have nothing (directly) with it, she is going to die no matter what … there is no cure for it.

    How is that selfish? the only thing she ever had was singing … she sings because that is the only thing she have and the only thing she can give, at least is better that just wait for her inevitable death.

    And Alto … take a good look at the Frontier Fleet, its falling apart and guess who did it? the Vajra … Alto reasoning of “its us or then” is more realistic that Ranka “I will go there, talk to then and make the fighting stop” idealism … since it worked SO WELL right? its not like they just started shooting at then after a while and Ai-Kun taken her and put her in the Queen Chamber?

    Maybe you should watch the original, the Zentradi were similar to humans and STILL decided it was better to wipe out humankind that being infected by culture with SDF Macross using culture to shock the Zentradi so it would make then easier targets.

    Drakron
    Reply

  42. @koyuki
    Omg, young!Brera is so cute~ Agreed. BreraxRanka’s sibling love is also really nice to watch. I love when he gave her his harmonica, though when he did that I immediately had bad vibes that’s something bad will happen to him. It did unfortunately. And Ai-kun…I think when the Vajra attacked him, he got enlightened and is now in colleague with the rest of the Vajras lol

    I’m convinced that Ranka’s voice caused the tragedy 11 years ago. The explosion of Macross from her flashback probably scared her and it made the Vajras go rampant—much like what happened in ep 20. Ranka may have finally remembered what she had done that’s why she’s now blaming herself for everything. I can’t wait for the finale because I’m pretty sure Ranka will not just sit there and let her Vajra go wild on everyone. She will bring it all down on herself.

    Also, if you noticed, Ranka called Ranshe and Grace “our moms”. Whatever does that mean? =/

    ani_d
    Reply

  43. I just have a feeling Alto is going to end up with Sheryl like how Hikaru and Misa ended up together in the end of the original Macross. Since Hikaru did join the military for Minmei and blah blah blah you should know the rest.

    Well 2 epis left, I wonder if its going to end or is there going to be a second season since the first Macross didn’t have a second season.

    tphan
    Reply

  45. We really don’t know what hit us, eh? Remember Nakamura Yuuichi’s words that the CONCLUSION of the love triangle will surprise people? THIS IS IT. This is the reason why Alto and him was mobbed in the studio. I don’t know about you, but I am hella surprised. Alto chooses Ranka, but decides to kill her for the sake of Frontier (with Sheryl in it). That’s a sasuke-coldness level.

    Black
    Reply

  48. And the triangle gets resolved. Now for the war with Ranka in the left corner and Alto on the right. Will the power of love overcome the boundaries? Will the misunderstanding ever ends? Alto wants to protect Frontier. Ranka blames herself for killing everyone 11 years and 3 episodes ago. Who will kill…Ranka first? Herself or Alto? Or is it everyone’s dark horse the NUNS? Super Galactic Love story you say? This is a Super Galactic Bout Story. Glory to deculture!

    @Black
    You’re not alone. Episode 22 is a faux with all the pity stuff. I was floored too, blinked for a couple of seconds then cheered because me wants to see Alto and Ranka bring it on.

    Melia
    Reply

  49. ARHGHHHHIOTEHGHHGHHH!!!
    GODDAMNIT RANKA END!!!!!!!

    You can totally tell that the devil Kawamori’s setting up for a darned Ranka x Alto end. By letting Sheryl have her “fun time” with Alto right, it’s basically giving Sheryl her last chance with Alto so she can let go without regrets.

    &)$&)(@&$@)(& (obscenities censored)

    I am RAGING SO HARD right now that my veins are popping.
    The Sheryl fanboy in my is EPIC RAGE

    LONG LIVE Sheryl x Alto!!!!

    W-General
    Reply

  52. I’m thiiiis close to bursting, but I’m going to play nice here. *halo*

    What happened here is just the confirmation of what was said last week. Alto is really staying with Sheryl out of pity and obligation. Alto is not saying anything but Sheryl knows it. She doesn’t want anymore pity going by what she said to Luca. Sheryl knows that Alto always cared more for Ranka but she chooses to keep quiet because she wants to spend a little more time with him. (She’ll dump you later Alto, you can bet your pretty head on it.) By the way Luca grew in 7 days time. lol wut?

    What Ozma said to Alto before escaping proves to be right. What Michael has told Alto proves to be right. What Yasaburo has told Alto proves to be right. Alto-hime is running away and pretending he is not noticing stuff. Someone should put this actor to jail now. He is running away from his situation, from what he really feels, from everything. But now, he decided he will stop and will take everyone into the account. He will be an adult and not a dumb person like Ozma who claims he’s a MAN by doing what he wants and forsaking Frontier. Ozma will pwn him later on again before they pwn Leon and Bilrer. Fer sure. So his decision turned out to be to protect Frontier than to protect the ultimate reason he joined SMS. Amidst so many people’s lives, what is Ranka’s life anyway? Just one over a million. 1000000 > 1. Nevermind that he loves Ranka. He does the right thing. A logical choice.

    Klan Klan who knows the woman’s heart did not even scold Alto for swinging away from her fellow woman Sheryl and even defined Alto’s feelings. “Is that your love?” In order to protect the people of Frontier, Alto is willing to sacrifice his most important girl when worst comes to worst. To preserve Ranka from being a tool for the Vajra, and to protect everyone who is living in Frontier, he is going to do it. That’s love. Watch Alto chicken out in the end once Ranka herself decides to do it for him.

    @Black
    Ah huh. This is what Yuuichi’s talking about. The surprising part was the part where he said Ranka o kurosu. I always had a thing for Basilisk so I liked what he said.

    diva
    Reply

  54. @diva
    Wow it actually made a lot of sense to me. I agree that a recurring theme in Macross Frontier is teenagers running away from their responsibilities and from who they are because they do not want to face reality.
    Alto is running away from himself unsure of what he wants to do in life and who he wants to protect. He sees his mother as a loved one he wanted to protect but could not. He blames his father for losing that loved one and grows to hate everything associated with that person. He tries to do the same for both Ranka and Sheryl but only Sheryl is at arms reach so he focuses on her. He loses sight of even these by eventually going back to his old house which he promised to never come back and through his constant shifting feeling between the heroines
    Sheryl is running away from the harsh reality that she will eventually die alone and lose the people she loves and cares. This would cause her to go back into her sad lonesome state in the ghettos of Macross Galaxy which is why she wants Alto to stay by her side. Until she tells Alto the reason why she feels like this, she is technically still running away because she desires company and not love.
    Ranka is running away from her responsibilities, the harsh reality that the one person she cared about and for whom she has done everything would not like her the way she likes him and from her past.
    Michael ran away from the concept of being loved by degrading the concept of love through his numerous girlfriends. Losing his sister at a young age, he found loving to be something grim and that he was truly afraid of opening himself up to someone only to lose that loved one through death.

    Wow Thank You diva for that insightful epiphany. Unfortunately, I cannot accept wholeheartedly your stance that Alto’s true love is Ranka and that everything he has been doing has been his way of denying his true feelings for said character. I believe that Alto is mentally stressed right now from everything that is happening and he is only being swept away by the events. This problem causes him to be irrational and he cannot fully realize his turbulent emotions such as desire and love.

    This new portrayal of Alto in my eyes reminds me of the emotional teen that is Amuro Ray in the novel version of Gundam. Like Alto, Amuro is a teen first and therefore does not consciouly think about who his decisions affect his reality and the people around him. He only does what he thinks is rewarding and beneficial for him.

    nycs
    Reply

  55. Yeah, well. If Omni would have typed in Klans opinion a bit more ambiguously ( as it was mean, as agreed upon several japanese speakers in chat ), then it wouldn´t sound as bad for Sheryl.

    As it looks at the moment, it´s a fake-out. Alto also speaks a lot about how he has to protect Frontier, and if necessary will kill Ranka, after which Klan goes “Is this your love?”. Most likely meaning “Your love for Frontier is that great…?”, and Sheryl overhears and misunderstands that he means Ranka alone.

    And, yeah, Alto joined SMS to protect Ranka. Didn´t Hikaru join the military to impress Minmay? ^^

    Magnus
    Reply

  56. @Magnus

    Sure, think whatever you like. The episode can be taken in as how one interprets it anyway. ^^ But I won’t be expecting much SherylxAlto if I were you.

    This one is not addressed to anyone in particular. (Because I forgot who said this.) One thing is clear now, Alto DID join BECAUSE of Ranka and her song in ep3. It wasn’t because of Sheryl’s destiny speechy. At least we can see clearly now that Ranka DID a great impact on Alto, even without her giving him advices~

    My take on Alto’s “If blah blah, I will kill Ranka.” speech is this:
    He doesn’t want Ranka to be used in a battle like that. Also, to make sure Ranka didn’t do anything that he knew Ranka would feel bad about. Maybe he has remembered Ranka’s little speech, “I don’t want to sing as a tool for fighting Vajra.”

    Alto will protect Ranka even if it means to kill her, to end her pain. T___T Drama… I so want to see what will be the dialogue for this if it ever happens…

    Too bad Brera goes blank and memory-less again. =( I hate Grace to pieces! I have a big hunch that it will be Ranka standing on the bridge of Frontier in ep25 (accdg to summary). I hope none of the three main characters die..

    yuKime
    Reply

  57. @nyc
    I try 😀

    Ranka stated here that she wants to stop the fighting. She didn’t run away from Frontier. She’s been running away for 20 episodes by being a singing tool and refusing to remember. Alto’s useless advice to her in 13 even was : ‘Forget about it’. An advice from a fellow runner. What can you expect? Ranka stopped running in 21 when she decided she’d find out the truth behind the research fleet. It was just tough luck that what she found was something she never wanted to find out. She killed everyone. In Alto’s case, he stopped running here and made a decision. They all choose their destiny.

    @magnus
    “Didn´t Hikaru join the military to impress Minmay?”

    And? What does that got to do with Alto and Ranka?

    diva
    Reply

  58. @yukime
    Yea, Ozma will kick him later and say if “If you don’t want Ranka to be a tool, you’re going to kill her you bastard?! Wake up! If you’re a man, protect the woman you love and protect everyone all at the same time. Multi-task, damn it!” XD

    diva
    Reply

  59. @diva

    Yeah!!! Multi-tasking is the solution! *thumbs up* Alto just had to think up the most dramatic solution to put more drama in his life. Him running away from everything was dramatic enough, jeez. Oh, and magnus point is the similarities (some) of SDF Macross (original Macross) to Macross Frontier, saying Hikaru wanted to impress Minmei but ended up with Misa instead. But I think the situation here is different. Alto wanted to protect Ranka, not impress. Ranka didn’t need to convince Alto the way Minmei had to with Hikaru to join SMS. Alto joined ON HIS OWN WILL, wanting to fight and protect Ranka.

    To make someone like that as your reason for fighting, it has to be love! And no, he’s not pretending anymore so every word he spoke in this episode is nothing but the truth. Plain truth. I hope Alto realizes that there is something else that can be done, not just killing Ranka! (But I think he was just thinking, if worst scenario happens. I do believe he still has some plans up his sleeves, not just immediately go kill Ranka.)

    Oh, and I don’t know why but Kawamori’s words echo in my head now. “Once Alto realizes his feelings, he will go all the way to see it through.” Not exactly the words but it has the same meaning, referring to the love triangle.

    yuKime
    Reply

  61. Hey! Someone get Alto a cape for the final episode! He’ll pull out Ranka’s naked body from the mother Vajra after saying “i love you…I love You! I LOVE YOU!” I knew it’s going to be all gundam g from here. Who knew this is what Alto’s seiyuu meant about the conclusion of the love triangle. Wicked!

    Fatal_Fury
    Reply

  63. I think nothing built on misunderstanding and hurt of another character will ever be anything that will last. So, I don’t understand Ranka fan cheering right now.

    @nyc

    Sheryl is running away from the harsh reality that she will eventually die alone and lose the people she loves and cares. This would cause her to go back into her sad lonesome state in the ghettos of Macross Galaxy which is why she wants Alto to stay by her side. Until she tells Alto the reason why she feels like this, she is technically still running away because she desires company and not love.

    I don’t think Sheryl is running away at all. If anything she is running full force towards her death, even refusing help to slow her disease. For one she doesn’t want to burden Alto anymore because she thinks it’s pity and for another she wants to help the people of Frontier while she still can. She also didn’t go back into her lonesome orphan state. She was reminded of what she didn’t have as a child and what she really longed for now. Her dream. Which was simply a nice dinner and someone she loved to share it with. She feels that way because she desires love and affection, someone she has never had in her life. Unlike Ranka, who was spoiled and loved by many people.

    lol
    Reply

  64. @diva: yuKime basically said what my point was.

    @yuKime: I can´t remember Hikaru joining *against* his will…

    Well, here are some other interpretations done by Japanese speaking people on AS, to broaden the discussion a bit.

    From MaiHikari:

    “* It’s interesting to note the conversation between Alto and his brother. His brother wants him to consider what he wants and if fighting and killing is really what he wished for. This is reaffirmed with Klan’s question: “is this your form of love?” In my opinion, that question is after all a question, not an answer. She thinks Alto’s view of love, if it is true, is quite sad–meaning to kill someone close to him in order to protect everyone else. But she is asking him, because she doesn’t think that that is his true form of love. Again, the series wants Alto to consider an alternative solution to the war other than killing off the enemy.

    * Alto joined SMS to protect Ranka, and now to protect the rest of Frontier, he is willing to kill Ranka. There are a few ways to interpret this. The first, which was brought up in this forum, and I don’t agree with: Alto wants to kill Ranka for her own good because he loves her and doesn’t want to see her turn bad. If that is what Alto’s thinking, then he’s just selfishly using “Ranka’s sake” as an excuse to kill her, despite her own wishes to live, even to live with him. In this case, he is a coward and a hypocrite. The second, which is reaffirmed by the theme of the series and by Alto’s brother and Klan’s words, is that he simply wants to protect but his method is really the wrong way to do it. He can’t protect something by destroying something else. That is not what love means. Thus, what Klan wants to tell Alto in this episode is not referring to Alto’s romantic love, but his misguided methods.”

    From Monir:

    “When Klan asked, “Alto, sore ga omae` no ai ka?”… she isn’t exactly asking Alto who is he going to pick for his romantic interest, rather, .. she is making a very sad observation. Let me elaborate. Does Alto like Sheryl? Yes. Does Alto like Ranka? Yes. Alto also likes the people who chooses to live in this fragile world. Alto is declaring that he wouldn’t mind killing one of his loved one if it means avoiding mass destruction for those people. From that line of thought, it seems, Alto’s definition of “love” is too vast, so it renders him unable to be tied down by the affection of one or two people. I think that’s what Klan realizes just now, and Sheryl has been into such realization for some time already. They can love him all they want, but he is incapable of returning it to either of them to their liking because of his scope of perception.”

    ( Not my favourite interpretation, of course ^^ ).

    From Darial:

    “I am actually really amused at the whole angst about Episode 23’s ending part.
    Alto’s feeling for the two female leads shifted and changed throughout the series. To say Alto’s feelings for both Ranka and Sheryl remain static is to deny all the character developments that have taken place in the 22 prior episodes.

    Sure, Alto joined SMS with an urge to protect Ranka and Frontier (as well as flying) back in episode 3. But does he still feel the exactly the same way about Ranka in episode 23? Maybe, maybe not. Did he have feelings for Ranka, sure, at one point. Does he still have that feeling now? Who knows, other than he said will kill her to protect Frontier if push comes to shove.

    As for Alto’s feelings toward Sheryl, if he still feels the same way about her as he did in episode 3, he probably wouldn’t have promised to stay by her side until the very end.

    Therefore, to use one of Alto’s original reasons to join SMS to show he is in love with Ranka in Episode 23 is simply not supported by anything in fact or logic. The Alto of episode 23 is a very different person, and he still hasn’t told us who he truly love yet.

    Thus, at the end of 23, Sheryl misunderstood the context of Alto’s discussion with Klan. And that’s fine. Kawamori has to milk two more episodes of dramatic tension, and if he needs to milk more sympathy from Sheryl fans, he’ll do it without hesitation.

    The true ending is still far from certain, and anything is possible. My opinion is that Sheryl and Ranka are on two separate tracks with different “positive growth” endings for each character where each of them will be happy in their own ways. But that’s just my opinion.

    IMHO, Ranka fans should not be celebrating this soon, and Sheryl fans shouldn’t get depressed at all. There are still two episodes left where anything can happen, and the fact Alto is still on Frontier speaks volumes in my mind.”

    I hope this sparks some discussion. 🙂

    magnuskn
    Reply

  66. judging from the episode didn’t Sheryl walk in half way through the convo? So she didn’t hear the first half she only heard about what he said about Ranka. So ranka shippers stfu before I gut you like a pig!

    Kaori
    Reply

  67. Come on Kawamori, stop producing any more Macross “sequels”. Is this the best you can come up? Frontier is no better than 7 and Zero. It is all drama using science fiction as a backdrop. What’s worst, you’ve produced a lot of shippers debating endlessly on what? Who’ll the main character will end up with. That’s how horrible your story for this Macross “sequel.”

    sf_fan
    Reply

  69. @sf_fan
    If shippers can debate over their pairings, doesn’t that mean Kawamori is successful in making good story and characterization? Either way, you are quite generalizing that older anime have better story. It’s quite insulting to the Japanese if you think they’re losing their touch. So do you think you are a better storyteller or producer? Don’t whine if you don’t like the story development or the fans reactions to the anime.

    Kagami
    Reply

  70. @diva
    Yes. Multitask IS the solution. Kudos! Nice analysis.

    @yukime
    Alto finally realized his feelings. Now we get to see things move in a big way. ^__^ I can’t wait for the finale.

    @magnus
    I may have limited japanese but I perfectly understood that little scene of Alto/Klan. They really weren’t saying anything complicated afterall. Frankly, I’m getting exasperated debating about RankaxAlto since any Sheryl shipper can paint this scene to whatever will comfort them and interpret Klan’s “omae no ai” into anything but romantic.

    I’m sorry, but there should be a limit between denial and being objective. The guy just admitted that it was Ranka that made him join SMS. To fight and to protect from there on. His flashbacks were composed of bits and pieces of his memories of Ranka while he was saying this. Alto fought to protect her, and this coincides with his hate towards Brera who constantly rubbed on his face that he is to protect Ranka not him. Alto’s feelings towards Ranka is No Doubt much stronger than what he feels for Sheryl. They are not equal. This is why Sheryl teared up and said she “knew it”. I wouldn’t put this past her since I’ve always thought she knew. From how Alto acted in this episode, you can see discontent in his eyes, someone who is unhappy yet resolute to DO what is RIGHT. In order to protect the people who wants to live on in Frontier, he is willing to kill the one person he wanted to protect the most if she were to threaten them. Thus Klan’s tears. Oh, and Alto had a nice coaching from Leon and Bilrer btw. 😉

    After Galia 4, I’ve always been surprised that people are still calling Alto’s feelings for Ranka as “brotherly” just because he didn’t have any romantic move on her past 14, yet when they see Alto act like this with Klan’s direct label, they get all surprised claiming that this is completely out of the blue. -___- Seriously. AltoxRanka has been screaming at our faces ever since the beginning.

    @Black
    I was also taken aback by Alto here, so I take it this is definitely why Nakamura Yuuichi and Alto were mobbed in the recording studio—-the infamous surprised conclusion of the LT.

    ani_d
    Reply

  71. ani_D: Well, I cited three different people with quite different interpretations, which *all* differ from yours. My own interpretation, going by the excellent translations I got from ickem, is of course Sheryl-biased, but I think my reading of the relationship is one of brotherly concern. Which in itself is kind of love, but not the kind of love you are hoping for.

    Oh, well. Two weeks, then we´ll know for sure, unless Kawamori is *really* trolling us.

    magnuskn
    Reply

  75. I wouldn’t even call it trolling… unless you want to call the events in KGNE, True Tears and Macross (and so many others) trolling as well… Don’t forget ani_d that after episode 12 I predicted Sheryl would look screwed at the end, just like the winners from KGNE, True Tears and Macross were. How could you forget Romance 101! XD

    Westlo
    Reply

  76. そして俺はあいつに出会った。あいつを守るため、SMSに入ることを選んだ。戦うこと・・・守ること・・・それからずっと・・・

    And then I met her. To protect her I chose to join the SMS. To fight… to protect… from that point, forever…

    Kind of ambigious when translated literally. But then again, you have to read between the lines when translating these sort of things.

    Yufanman
    Reply

  77. @westlo
    Well, Ranka looks screwed here. Even the love of her life will kill her. Going by Romance 101, everything will turn out right by episode 25. When I say that everything will turn out right, that includes you getting bankrupt. 😉

    ani_d
    Reply

  84. @ Ranka

    Haha. Oh well. Fighting about who’ll end up with Alto spices up the forums.

    @ Westlo

    2 episodes??? How the hell can they wrap up everything with just 2 measly episodes remaining??? Maybe there’s a possibility of a season 2 (unless, there are already plans for one?)

    Eri
    Reply

  85. @yuKime
    I may have limited japanese but I perfectly understood that little scene of Alto/Klan. They really weren’t saying anything complicated afterall. Frankly, I’m getting exasperated debating about RankaxAlto since any Sheryl shipper can paint this scene to whatever will comfort them and interpret Klan’s “omae no ai” into anything but romantic.

    Ahhh, yuKime, you are half right for this one. I give my 2 cents to your language. The language is not complicated, as it is only “Sore ga, omae no ai?” which can be translated as “Is that you (idea of) love?” roughly. However, you must understand that the situation itself is NOT PLAUSIBLE for it to be considered romantic situation or question. Yes, the problem is the situation of the dialogue.

    Before that scene, Alto was talking about protecting Ranka, yes, however, he then said that he would kill Ranka if or because (not sure if it “if” or “because”, my head was a li’l sleepy on this part) Ranka joined the vajras. This is where I have doubt in my mind that Klan may not be talking about “romantic love”, since I don’t have any comprehension of “love=kill” logic. Klan’s question is considered to be a lot more ambiguous, as Klan did not state “what” love and “for whom/what”.

    “Ai” is literally translated to love, but it has a lot of different meaning context. It is not only bordered on romantic love, it may be said as love on different kind of assumption, i.e. strong friendship, siblings. (This is excluding “patriotism” love which is different, but Alto’s act is not a patriotism though he wanted to protect Frontier) If it were, then I can say that Beyblade’s anime has 100% BL scene in one of the last episode lol ^^;.

    In any case, I can only think that in the scene, Sheryl is the one who misinterpreted the question and Alto’s reaction (C’mon, you know she is dying and have feeling that Alto was pitying her…). In my opinion for the “love” matter, I would interpret it as love for Frontier : “Is that your idea of love for the Frontier? To kill one who you initially wanted to protect along with this Frontier?”

    I might be wrong, but since the scene is meant to be ambiguous for now (a.k.a typical Kawamori troll scene until he clarified it), I don’t see why anyone can interpret this as Alto’s love for Frontier : This is Alto’s development episode, his resolution for his own choice episode. Triangle resolution still can be milked two more episode from now.

    That said, now I really have to refuse Alto/Ranka end. So sorry, but I would have to damn Kawamori to hell if he decided to royally screw Sheryl at this point. Besides, I’m getting a REAL MAJOR DYRL and SDF vibes here…

    Kagami
    Reply

  89. @Kagami
    If Alto joined SMS to simply protect ‘people’, it would be a completely different matter, but since the guy joined to protect ONE single person, it is rather difficult to interpret it as Alto’s love for Frontier (at least for me)… Moreover, he never showed any care for his homeland. On the contrary, he even said he hated it, because there was no real sky (of course he was exaggerating a bit, but still…)!
    No…love for Frontier is simply out of question.

    In my opinion, Klan is not asking just about Alto’s perception of love as such (be it romantic,strong friendship,etc.). It seems to be more about love AND duty (eg. to protect Frontier). Or maybe love AND doing whatever you believe is right (we are the good ones, Vajra are the bad guys)…

    Now is that your idea of love Alto? To kill the one you care about if he or she joins your enemy (or becomes your enemy’s tool)? Won’t you try to understand, to rescue that person? And here comes the most important (and most complicated) question… WHY?
    The answer depends on how we think he feels about Ranka (and Frontier, of course)…

    On a side note, the “love=kill” logic is actually pretty logical (though pretty twisted as well). Ever read anything by Kaori Yuki XD ? It means that the person loves someone very much, but still hasn’t forgiven what he sees as a his/hers betrayal… I think that this explanation would kinda fit Alto with his stubbornness (just theoretically…), but again, this is Macross, not Angel Sanctuary…

    Ardea
    Reply

  90. “No…love for Frontier is simply out of question.”

    Which is why it showed images of Frontier and talked about protecting Frontier right before he made his I’ll kill Ranka statement, because it’s meaningless right? You realize he’s putting Frontier above Ranka right? And just because someone says they hate something doesn’t mean they want to see it go, refer to Sheryl’s reaction to Galaxy being “attacked”.

    Westlo
    Reply

  96. I think there is no need to fret so much: as of now, both Ranka and Sheryl are still candidates for Alto’s Love, as long as he doesn’t clearly express himself and his feelings, which will be happening in the 2 next weeks ^^

    But I was surprised to hear Alto joined the SMS for Ranka: I watched back the first episodes and no matter in what angle I looked at it, it was mainly for himself –> he wanted to fight, he wanted to fly, and somehow I think he was also rebelling against his father and cutting completely with acting but…for Ranka? I mean, really, in the first eps of the series Alto wasn’t specially close to neither girls, and definitely not to the point of joining the army for neither’s sakes…it was disappointing to have him saying he joined them for a girl, while I believed it was one of the *very few* serious decisions about his life he took 🙁

    Sherry
    Reply

  97. @Westlo
    Well, I do remember writing that his statement about hating Frontier was exaggerated… but I should have probably expressed myself a little bit better:
    Klan’s question IS ambiguous (and can be interpreted in many ways) but interpreting it as asking about Alto’s love for Frontier just didn’t sound that good to me. However, I do not say that she is asking him about his love for Ranka, either. It’s more about his general idea of love… but as I can see, I have already written this as well…

    Actually, I don’t think that Ranka herself – who we all know(and many MF fans hate)- is that important in this particular conversation. Or Sheryl… I really really tried to avoid any shipping in my post, and that’s why I used the word ‘person’… so, how about discussing this scene (which is a very well written, intense and moving one, no matter how you look at it) on a more general level? How about simply enjoying the first moment we are given some serious insight into Alto’s mind XD ?

    Ardea
    Reply

  98. Yay finally Alto actually gets some real development, but that doesn’t raise his rating in my book since he spent an exhausting 22 episodes running away from himself. Who gives a shit who he ends up with anymore? Anyway, we all know by now that he’s decided that if Ranka’s song is going to destroy Frontier, he’d choose the ‘lesser evil’ in his book despite whatever feelings he may have for her if it’s weighed up against the fate of humanity on Frontier. A hard but noble choice, if Ranka really meant that much to him.

    But hmm, based on Ranka’s overflowing sense of guilt over being the cause of so many deaths I smell a kamikaze scene.

    Frustratingly too little has been revealed in this episode about what happened in the past, and that all that’s certain is that Brera and Ranka are siblings (aww damn XD), and it seems obvious that Ranshe Mei had sympathies towards the Vajira and disagreed with Grace on her methods. Ranshe was also in Ranka’s memory flashback when the Vajira appeared, together with Brera, and she didn’t seem at all horrified or surprised when they came up over the hill, which makes me suspect that she knew what was coming. We also still don’t know why Ranka’s hooked up to the Vajira’s network, if she’s not sick with the V-Virus like Sheryl.

    Grace being able to see through Ranka being ‘hooked’ up to the main network is freaky. Talk about a ‘mad scientist’s dream come true’ scene.

    nezumibento
    Reply

  99. @Ardea
    Yes, initially he joined to protect Ranka. That I can admit and it is shown for Christ Sake. I still have doubts though in his current state that he still wanted to protect Ranka. I will explain in the next paragraphs of why do I think so.

    Are you sure it is impossible for him to love Frontier? As much as I can gather, his dream is to fly in the real sky. Using his inability to fly in the real sky as his hate to Frontier does not seem plausible to me. Yes, he may dislike it, but imo, I think he still care for the people in Frontier great deal. Perhaps I need to clarify better in this post that Frontier that I mean in the previous post basically mean the people on Frontier (Sorry for the confusion if this is the case). Evidence? Episode 20, where he wanted Ranka to sing, so that people won’t die. And also the statement of him protecting Frontier just before saying he would kill Ranka. Who says he hates Frontier? The colony, may be dislike, but his concern for people is genuine. Which is why I would still stand on my statement.

    In one sense, that can be accounted. But since Klan was asking specifically about his idea about ‘love’, I don’t really think duty or anything would need to be added. As for the ambiguous interpretation, I really do hope that yours is not the case, since his silence may foreshadow something terrible for their relationship… (That’s just me, of course)

    ( OT but boy, do I have to wonder how much Kawamori loves to mess with the simplest word possible 😛 )

    Do read her works 😉 You are dealing with Kaori Yuki veteran fan here ^^; Unfortunately, as long as I have lived, I have never ever seen Kawamori doing any “love=kill” logic particularly the romantic ones and I have to say, he has the ability to deliver what love truly means without having to resort to such kind of twisted relationship. At this point, Alto cares about Ranka (how much I do not know) but his hate to Vajras is more overwhelming that he would not forgive Ranka’s actions these past two episodes. I would not say that he would not forgive Ranka in the end though considering Kawamori’s past Macross works ^^ Relationship resolution would be different though…

    Kagami
    Reply

  100. @Kagami
    Aaa… now I understand it…stupid me, too focused on the ‘Frontier=colony’ part (somehow forgetting the ‘Frontier=citizens’^^;)… And I maybe used a bit too strong words to express my opinion… I never wanted to say that he really hates Frontier, just to point out that it’s Alto we’re speaking about here… and Alto is…well, Alto… the image of him being dedicated to his colony seemed just absurd to me… that’s why I said it was out of question…

    But now that I finally see the light on the end of the tunnel (and as I hope, explained my point of view a bit better), don’t you think that our opinions are actually quite similar? Your ‘love for Frontier’ and my ‘duty to protect’?

    Which means that I didn’t really have the right to post anything, since I simply misunderstood… and was unintentionally repeating your words without bringing anything new to the discussion…

    OT To me, the scene just screamed Lucifer x Mika-chan (you know, the part with Setsuna pointing his sword on Mika-chan and saying ‘because you loved him the most’)… and in my twisted mind, the first thought was: sooo tragic but soo romantic(it even brought tears to my eyes T-T)…and than I remebered whose work am I watching… but i like the whole Kawamori’s ‘peaceful solution’ idea…

    Ardea
    Reply

  101. @Ardea
    Aaah! So that’s it! Sorry for undetailed reasoning in my part too! I do know that he dedicated completely to colony is quite absurd, that’s why I simply add that Alto’s act is not patriotism i.e. Act of complete “trust”/Dedication/Idealism to one’s country. Glad we can clear misunderstanding ^v^

    Yes, it does 🙂 But mine is different since I used the term love, which associated with feelings while you used duty, which is associated with obligation.

    You have added the new possibility of Klan asking his general idea of love, so you have bring forth something new to discuss 😉 I’ll leave it to others to discuss which one seems more plausible for “love”…

    OT: Hehe, if Kaori-sensei can make someone’s mind becomes twisted and shipped the most twisted and psychotic things (but tragic…;_; Don’t remind me of LuciferxMika! I love them so much that I stopped reading Angelic Sanctuary (will pick up again since I need to overcome it) due to my fear of Kaori-sensei love for tragedy…! She killed my OTP in Count Cain! RiffxCain…;_;), then Kawamori is the blessing of the God that spread love to the world~ XD Bless his heart, but not his brain and eeeeevil intention of trolling~

    Kagami
    Reply

  102. Eh…? Now that I see my second last post… Why do the reason of why I think Alto don’t still want protect Ranka disappear…? Oh well, before I become rabid shippers’ food, why not just throw wood to the small fire now 😛 ?

    As for the Alto protecting Ranka, I think it is possible for Alto to develop that feeling of protection since the third episode. We have seen that he fights not only for Ranka since that episode-he slowly realizes his duty (or desire) is extending to a larger target, particularly the Frontier’s people. This does not mean he does not want to protect Ranka, but it’s just that Ranka is not his sole protection role anymore. If he still have that feeling, then he should join Ranka and Brera going to the lala– I mean Vajra’s planet. That way, he can always protect Ranka… But Alto has flat-out rejected her plead, and the second chance, he still don’t follow SMS Quarter. So this pretty much negate Alto’s intention to protect Ranka… (Of course, my AxS fan part want to add something… But let’s just leave triangle romance alone for now…)

    … Actually if I am Ranka shippers/ AxR shippers, I would definitely fear that Alto join to protect Ranka… SDF gauge o’ meter just explode now… Then again… The “negated pineapple cake… But it’s not completely Salad… *FRUSTRATED*

    With these being said… Time to run away! *hides under the table*

    Kagami
    Reply

  107. It’s too soon to come to any conclusions about the triangle. The writers are just messin’ with our heads. How many times have we been mislead? Way too many times. But its all in fun, it keeps everyone guessing.

    At times I want to rage about what is going on and how it would suck if Sheryl doesn’t get some kind of a happy ending, her life’s been manipulated by Grace so much. Just one night of happiness with Alto is not enough. I’d punch the writers in the head if they screw this up! I will not be denied! lol

    Barbwire Wings
    Reply

  108. -___- *sigh*

    Well anyone is free to twist “is that your love?” to whatever will fit their liking. I said my piece (w/c is Alto deciding to kill his most important girl for the sake of Frontier) but don’t expect another turn around from here on. It already happened in 22. When you look at a misunderstanding scene (19), you CAN tell right away that the character is meant to misunderstand. The scene with Sheryl isn’t misunderstanding scene, it’s portrayed as a resignation coated with a slight selfishness. It’s the same as those other cliche scenes where the other girl accepts that the guy doesn’t love her, but is okay to be the second best (for a little more time atleast).

    Alto’s choice is/has always been Ranka, but Alto WILL stay with Sheryl and Frontier because that is the right thing to do. This is the conclusion of the LT shown in episode 23. This also the reason why I think Sheryl herself will leave Alto later and focus on becoming the greatest songstress of the Galaxy which parallels the recent Newtype interviews.

    More than interpreting this very straightforward, I also would rather talk about Ranka’s past, the big belt around the Vajra homestar (it’s not a part of a big vajra, right?), and speculation about how the Finale will go.

    ani_d
    Reply

  109. @magnus, mai hikari
    “Thus, what Klan wants to tell Alto in this episode is not referring to Alto’s romantic love, but his misguided methods.””

    The half second paragraph is on the spot, except for this. Klan is referring to Alto’s misguided methods and his romantic love. You can separate the two together, but you absolutely can COMBINE the two thoughts together and in this case, it’s a mixture of both. Klan’s tears is the best resistance she can give ragarding Alto’s decision. It’s a very sad decision. 🙁

    Dei
    Reply

  111. @Kagami
    And now, allow me to be carried away by my idea a little bit…
    Blame the Ranka shipper in me, but really I think that interpreting the scene Kaori Yuki-style would be just awesome. It would give both characters (and their relationship)a very unexpected depth. Just imagine the dark, tragic and beautiful love story it would make – rather than fighting as enemies or being the witness of her being used as a tool he would kill his love (and then kill himself, of course)-

    …oh well, I suppose I should stop daydreaming right now and face the reality…

    OT:I actually stopped reading Angel Sanctuary because of the same reason… too afraid to know how many of my favourite characters will die… And Mika was btw. my most favourite character… I always suspected him to be much more clever than he ever let the others know XD

    Ardea
    Reply

  112. What just happened? All along Ranka has been the most important girl to Alto? And all along Alto was aware that she fancies him? And all along these two are loving each other and they haven’t done anything because of lack communication? It explains how happy they are flying in that VF at Galia.:(

    I rewatched episode 21 with my new perception of Alto. It teared me up when Blue Ether started right as they showed Ranka and Alto’s times together. His words “iku na Ranka!” sound much heavier now because of this episode. The reason he joined SMS was flying away from him for reasons he couldn’t understand. And with his limited knowledge of the real situation he couldn’t do anything about it. If you can just imagine how much pain Alto felt when Ozma pushed him to make a move based on Ranka’s action. He must’ve been really torn. The girl he loves just did something bad and he was being insinuated to do the same thing?

    It’s terribly sad to see these two separate like this only to meet up as enemies all because of another misunderstanding. Alto doesn’t know why Ranka really left. He immediately believed Leon and Bilrer’s skewed knowledge. Alto doesn’t know that Ranka is little by little realizing that her naivety (stop the war), and that she also wishes for peace like him. Ranka doesn’t know that she was the reason Alto joined SMS. She doesn’t know that she was just as important to Alto just as she was.

    Now it’s too late because everything has turned and they both chose their own path away from each other. The next time they meet, it will be in the battlefield, and will Alto really carry out his pledge to protect Frontier at the cost of Ranka’s life? Despite the piled misunderstandings? Dark. Everything is so dark as of this moment.

    miss rini
    Reply

  113. I’m having a hard time predicting who the hell is going to win this. Right now both Sheryl and Ranka are in messed up/screwy situations. Usually the person in the worst position close to the end does end up winning right? But things look bad for both of them. I felt there were really strong points in favor of Ranka. The whole putting Ranka and Alto on opposing sides leading up to the finale is just the sort of cliche/typical setting where you just know they will make up in the end. No way Alto is going to kill Ranka. It’s simply not going to happen. The only point in Sheryl’s favor this episode is the fact that she did overheard the conversation between Alto and Klan and now seems to think Alto loves Ranka. That’s also a very typical plot device. The story is giving me strong DYRL vibes with Sheryl as Misa. However, there is no saying Kawamori will continue to go that direction. He might decide to let the Minmei of the story win in the end.

    zalem
    Reply

  115. Until I hear Alto say “Aishiteru” to either Ranka or Sheryl, won’t believe the triangle is over.

    I’ve seen and hoped and thought things go one way only to be smashed against the rocks to realize things aren’t what they appear to be.

    I know people have their ideas of what the current status is, but how often are those theories proven wrong for either camp? Too often for me to believe what is. There are many great ideas and observations on both sides, I wish we could all agree on somethings. 🙂

    On another note, Sheryl being drunk and pleading to be carried off to bed, priceless!

    I guess my only hope at this point is that Kawamori doesn’t feel like he needs to kill off Ranka, Sheryl, or Alto. Wishful thinking on my part, I know.

    I just want everyone to be happy! =D

    Barbwire Wings
    Reply

  116. Okay kids, it’s time for a little heresy:

    Sheryl is NOT going to die. We’ve been set up.

    Let’s put the clues together, shall we, Fred? In Episode 12, Sheryl suddenly falls ill. She’s been perfectly healthy up to that point, then bang. But notice that in Ep. 13, Grace is trying to get Sheryl to take the mysterious “Magic” pill. If so far the pills have been holding off the illness, why haven’t we seen any sign of them before? Hmmm.

    Jump to Ep. 16. Sheryl is now staggering around sick all the time. Meanwhile, Kuran and Michel figure out that the meds she was taking have the same side effects that Sheryl is showing. But there is NOT ONE comment that shows that the effects of the V infection CAUSE these symptoms. Nope, the MEDS do. We can generally assume that Sheryl is still taking the meds since in the latest episode (23) she has a big bottle of them on her nightstand. So she’s still feeling sick.

    So what’s going on? Hmm. Well Scooby, let’s go back to Episode 15, shall we? Grace shows up and we see that she swaps the blood sample the nurse has taken and put her own in it’s place? The question is why? Is the replacement sample one of clean blood without the V infection? Is the swap to hide the fact that Sheryl is sick? Doesn’t make sense–if Sheryl is already in terminal stage V infection, then there’s nothing anyone else can do to save her. So why hide the fact?

    But if the sample CONTAINS V infection, it makes sense. If Sheryl goes back to the doctors to check on Grace’s claims in Episode 18, the docs will find V infection in her labwork. Sheryl will believe Grace. The docs will prescribe the right meds to keep her alive–the very ones that have the nasty “chemo” effects. Sheryl will be sick as a dog and will assume that it’s the illness, not the meds. Grace then moves on to Ranka, having neatly disposed of Sheryl, who will believe she is dying. And that makes more sense than any other logic path.

    But what about the “V infection effect” Luca talks about in Ep 22? Hmm. Remember those earrings? The ones that Sheryl always wears…? The ones that are just like the ring Builder wears…?

    I think we’ve been set up by a master, kids. And they would have gotten away with it too if it wasn’t for those meddling Miyoshi Kids and their talking Vajra!

    maxnmike
    Reply

  117. “The story is giving me strong DYRL vibes with Sheryl as Misa. However, there is no saying Kawamori will continue to go that direction. He might decide to let the Minmei of the story win in the end.”

    The problem with that line of thinking is that Sheryl is going to be Minmei next episode.

    “This also the reason why I think Sheryl herself will leave Alto later and focus on becoming the greatest songstress of the Galaxy which parallels the recent Newtype interviews.”

    You realize it was her closing herself to Alto and proving herself as the greatest songstress by sacrificing her life against the Varja? Did you watch the entire episode or just the last few minutes? She’s not taking medicines so her fold waves get stronger as her sickness progresses, now she’s under the misunderstanding that Alto loves Ranka and that Alto stayed with her out of pity.

    You’re going to be raging when the Innocent Green BGM plays in episode 25… XD

    Westlo
    Reply

  119. Zalem, come over to AS, read the big post by Musouka in the Romance thread on page 112. If that one doesn´t give you courage for a SxA end, then I don´t know what.

    Man, Kawamori knows how to tug the heartstrings. My chest constricts a bit everytime I see the flashback Sheryl has during the dinner scene. Oh, ow ow ow.

    Magnus
    Reply

  120. “But Ranka has been the real Minmei of this story. Throughout it she has been compared to Minmei.”

    That’s true but it’s silly to ignore all the similar stuff between Minmei and Sheryl as well, like I said ages ago Sheryl is Sheryl but she’s a little bit of a mix between Do You Remember Love Minmei (big difference from TV) and Misa Hayase.

    The producers themselves Zalem spun Sheryl Vs Ranka as DYRL Minmei Vs TV Minmei, songstress vs songstress. This was back in the conception stage when they were thinking of doing another Macross Plus type triangle.

    Westlo
    Reply

  121. Time for speculations and theories!

    My theory why Ranka’s version of the V-Virus isn’t like Sheryl’s is that I suspect Ranshe Mei had been infected with it while she was in the womb. Say what if that were true, that it gave Ranka’s version of the ‘infection’ a different effect, that it slightly modified her dna and made her a ‘little queen’. Which would explain her link to the Vajira and the uniqueness of her ability. It kind of fits, because Ranshe was exhibiting some of the same kind of symptoms sheryl was by the time Ranka was 5 years old, meaning it was in a more advanced state of the disease. I also suspect that Ranshe knew that her infection had changed her daughter and her fate was somehow become intertwined with them, so possibly her protectiveness towards the Vajira is linked to fears that Grace would try to use Ranka as part of her experimentation (which she eventually did!).

    It was kind of nostalgic, seeing little Ranka and Brera with their mother. Ranshe was hot. Too bad the only thing Ranka got from her was her green hair.

    nezumibento
    Reply

  122. Aiyeee *\^.^/*!! Alto admitted that it was Ranka that made him join SMS. AWWWW!! Episode 3 was rly a sentimental episode for both Ranka and Alto. It’s always in their flashbacks. AWWWW!! Kayto. That’s how it is Sheryl. SherylxNoone!! Instead of feeling sad for Sheryl, the last scene with her on it made me chuckle. Her paper airplane flopped in an awkward manner mehehe Comedic XP

    @Miss rini
    I love your post! 🙁 I cried when I rewatched Blue ether too. Ranka and Alto need to get their facts straight and they’ll skip to my loo to dokun land. I can’t wait for the last episode!!

    Yeowmin
    Reply

  123. Speculations abound.. Emotions run high..

    Seems like the Alto-Sheryl theme is heading for a downward spiral. But still, I am rooting for Sheryl. I can’t get over the fact that with Sheryl, Alto shines.

    This episode was disheartening. A point of view of a Sheryl fan. Makes me think of swearing off Macross Frontier from my list of much much liked animes.

    Greynick
    Reply

  129. @ani_d (Firstly I have to apologize for misrecognized you as yuKime. Lack of sleep m(_ _)m )
    … ani_d, by all means, what do you mean by this statement :

    “Alto’s choice is/has always been Ranka”

    What, in any Kawamori’s name, makes you think like that? Oh my, you don’t say that because Alto joins SMS is because of Ranka : He luuuurve Ranka sooooo much and he will not kill Ranka because his love is definite and will overcome it! AxR End confirmed! Alto loves Ranka~

    I’m sorry for a slight offense that might happen, but surely, you have not forgotten SDF-M? So protect=love? Please, if anything, Alto stating he want to protect Ranka is his reason for joining SMS will still NOT have Alto ends up with Ranka. Let’s just put it in the simplest way : protect=/=love.

    And excuse me, The Newtype Interview? Tell me, what is Sheryl’s greatest desire? To have her song be heard by people? For everyone to be happy, like Ranka’s desire? No, it’s just a simple wish which originates from her f**ked up childhood : To be able to be with the one who she truly loves forever. I see no pararel assumption to the ending from the interview. And I don’t buy the Sheryl being happy “too” in Megumi’s comment would point AxR ending anyway-it implies that Ranka would be happy… And she has lots of chance to be happy if the happiness points to her desire fulfillment.

    And I really don’t want to point this out for Goodness sake, PUT. DOWN. YOUR. SHIPPING. GOGGLES. BEFORE. MAKING. CONCRETE. ASSUMPTION. ON. LT. Ranka and Sheryl, sadly for those who are already emotionally tired in following the triangle, is still on the play. Regardless of who is leading right now (which depend on each interpretation from both sides) The other one is still not counted out until the very end. And no more fake-out or turn? *Sigh* ani_d, if I were a romance director, I would have loved you so much because of that naivety, especially if I were Kawamori, who has been proven to be evil master of trolling since Macross was created. He is, after all, the one who gave me (and almost everyone who supports Hayase) scar from SDF in giving the last Minmei-Hikaru scene, though lots of us were sure that Misa is going be his choice.

    Regarding Klan scene, I’ll just drop it since you seems to be fixated on the romance only department without even considering another possibility from the situation. And it is truly ambiguous, since it was kinda discussed over and over at other forums which still ends in different opinions. Only those who are fixated in AxR would interpret it so straightforwardly without ambiguous inkling. Ranka’s past was explained in Episode 23 sans how did she get her Little Queen status.

    @Ardea
    Of course it would be possible if it was Yuki Kaori. I would buy that as AxR scene without any doubt… Until we face the Ebil Hory Froating Head himself. Reality sometimes hurt, and I do know how hurt it is^^;

    OT:Mika (Now that I started to read it again, wasn’t it Alexiel a.k.a Setsuna that have the kill=love scenario? Is it the name mistranslation, because I don’t have the English translated book, only have the Japanese ones @.@ Angel Sanctuary is a bad memory of mine that my head decided to erase it^^) is an incredible character! But I sense that she would be the one of the main villain in the series… Kaori Yuki-esque, you know 😀

    Kagami
    Reply

  130. @kagami
    lol no offense taken. If you don’t want to equate Alto’s decision to protect Ranka as romantic love then feel free. I just feel like people are trying too hard and reading too much into “Alto and Klan’s rooftop scene” all because they don’t like the first message it directly conveyed. Then come the later episodes and they didn’t get their turn-around they’ll complain that they didn’t see it coming and that they were cheated. Now we even have a pseudo-Alto up there saying that Alto used Ranka as an “EXCUSE” as to why so that he can join SMS. Where did that come from? Oh gosh -_-

    Alto loves Ranka romantically not brotherly. Ozma can feel this. Michael can feel this. If Galia 4 arc didn’t exist, if 21 didn’t exist, and we didn’t see Alto act like a school girl all blushy blushy and happy around Ranka, it wouldn’t be sufficient enough to say this. Between Sheryl and Ranka, can you honestly say Sheryl is more important to Alto than Ranka? No matter what angle I look at it, Ranka is the most important girl to him. If she’s the reason why he joined SMS, she has to be very special. More special than Sheryl. It’s not like we couldn’t see this. Alto always goes out of his way just to be there for Ranka ever since he met her.

    Alto and Klan are talking about the reason why they joined SMS. Alto said it’s Ranka, but if she becomes a threat to everyone, he’ll kill her. Klan goes “Is that your love?” This is very straightforward. Why can’t we just take it as it is, and stop going around the bush to find another meaning and try so hard to make it fit. -_- Alto is going to stay with Sheryl and Frontier. Sheryl fans should be happy with this already. More ‘opportunities’ for Sheryl, no?

    ani_d
    Reply

  131. While I really like Macross – this one has been a doozey. I sometimes feel like I’m still going to throw up! Up and down, up and down, left then right! Reverse! SIGH!

    Shoji Kawamori certain has us wound tight!

    I won’t state who I am cheering for, I’ve had enough of being wrong and then right and then wrong again. I’m sticking to just waiting for Alto to say finally “Aishiteru” to either Ranka or Sheryl and then fly off into the sunset the his chosen lady. Heck he may even say it to Bobby for all I know! That’d be a twist none of us saw coming! Doing it this way keeps my ‘balls’ out of Kawamori’s hands and keeps me from getting dragged into the shipping argument and driving me bonkers. Kawamori is the ultimate puppet master at messin’ with our heads & hearts.

    What if Brera and Alto kill each other? Brera trying to keep Ranka safe while Alto is trying to kill her from being used by the Vajra? Unlikely methinks!

    Barbwire Wings
    Reply

  132. “Alto and Klan’s rooftop scene” – How often must Klan be a tool to mislead us? First many people thought it was for Sheryl. Now she’s being used to make us think it’s Ranka. That busybody… 😉

    Fool me once, shame on Kawamori. Fool me twice, shame on me. Fool me thrice, apparently I just don’t learn from my mistakes! 🙂

    Barbwire Wings
    Reply

  133. While more than 12 hours have past, I’m going to place the spoiler tag.

    Show Spoiler ▼

    While this has some meaning to it, Alto does not say “Aishiteru” about/to anyone. There is too much Kawamori Doubt in that scene, so I’m going to wait for Kawamori Concrete Evidence that will fall from the skies and crush in my skull. Then I’ll believe it!!

    Barbwire Wings
    Reply

  135. The above t/l more or less shows how Alto used Ranka and other things as an excuse to run away and join SMS. But she’s not the sole and or #1 reason at that. Alot of things came into play. There is no love for Ranka in that scene imo. But I’m sure fans will look at it however they wanna look at it.

    GP
    Reply

  136. It’s scary when one’s work precedes you, at least if said work is in dire need of editing and is too literally translated to be easy on the english ears o.o

    And I think anyone waiting for an “aishiteru” directed anywhere, might be setting up for disappointment. The reason being that I perceive the japanese in general to finding the phrase sort of “heavy-handed”… I would say looking for other concrete evidence is the key…

    VF-25 Messiah
    Reply

  137. Ani_d I’m curious, do you think Alto loves Sheryl, the question is about Sheryl, not about Ranka or who he loves more out of the two.

    Anyway looks like my prediction on IRC last week that 22 will be the equivalent of True Tears 11 is coming true *whistles* Why do you keep falling for the same tricks ani_d XD

    Westlo
    Reply

  138. @ani_d
    I told you that I have dropped the Klan’s statement argument. It’s not only Sheryl’s fans who think that Klan’s statements is ambiguous anyway. My Japanese friend told me that she interpreted it as parrarel to Klan’s death, my local friends interpreted it as “Homeland” love. Other fans interpreted this and that as such. It would be ambiguous if you enter the context, not only the surface, ani_d. It’s not only me that has trouble with the language usage if we see it perceptively. And it would depend on the personal observation anyway… Also in which comment of mine do I use Alto protecting Ranka as an excuse? I even state that she is the initial reason of Alto joining SMS.<.<

    For now, regarding Alto’s love being brotherly or not, I will just save it until the series end. (Personally,I do think like that, but anyway…) One thing I can be sure is that Alto does feel something about Ranka, whatever it is, I still need confirmation.

    If Galia 4 arc didn’t exist, if 21 didn’t exist, and we didn’t see Alto act like a school girl all blushy blushy and happy around Ranka, it wouldn’t be sufficient enough to say this. Between Sheryl and Ranka, can you honestly say Sheryl is more important to Alto than Ranka? No matter what angle I look at it, Ranka is the most important girl to him. If she’s the reason why he joined SMS, she has to be very special. More special than Sheryl. It’s not like we couldn’t see this. Alto always goes out of his way just to be there for Ranka ever since he met her.

    Disregarding Sheryl in your argument would make it sounds biased, ani_d. Who says he does not have a big deal of concern to Sheryl too? He was concerned about Sheryl well-being enough that he place his worry than SMS Q message in Ep. 22. Which is quite rare, since he should be looking at the message in the firsthand. He is concerned about Sheryl that he constantly keep checking her condition when she is in hospital since he visited her (ep. 16). And some more which I was too lazy to point out since aneeshadc has pointed them in somewhere Ep 21 comments -_- It’s more or less subtler than Ranka’s but is definitely there. So Ranka, by all means, is not less or more special to Alto : BOTH Sheryl and Ranka are.

    Honestly, the blushing argument is getting really old and does not give lots credential to romantic development… If I were to point out, he does blush around Sheryl too. He blushes when he was teased too. Besides, at which point does he blush at Ranka? Ep. 10 and Ep. 13-the Gallia 4 Arc. After that zero to none. Really, carry on with the argument.

    Now for the reasoning of Ranka being very special for Alto that he even join SMS… I will point out that while this does happen in Episode 3 (btw, After rewatching Episode 3, it’s kinda hard to believe that protecting Ranka, since he does not give any of that indication at all… But I will concede to this until further confirmation given) by then, how many episodes have been spent after him joining? How many months have been spent in Macross timeline?

    Seriously, the girl who impacts Alto at that time may be Ranka, but time progress, and feeling does develop. Do you think Alto will remain static in his relationship with Sheryl? If he were, then he would not have given any damn to Sheryl these past episodes. Ranka is the one that is portrayed in the series to have a real static development with Alto… ( More than that if you said Ranka is special for Alto, why does he not follow Ranka in Episode 21 or have contemplation for Ranka’s departure in Episode 22? He even refuse to hear Ranka’s plead not to kill vajras. If Ranka is that precious to him, he should have try to think about it it beforehand… )

    All in all, to answer your argument : Klan’s statement is still ambiguous CONTEXT-WISE and BOTH girls are really portrayed as precious to him. At this point, no one is completely more special to him sans the protection which give Ranka the upper hand- We shall see whether the history will repeat or will be negated…

    (And to clarify, I did a mistake in one of my post : I see no pararel assumption to the ending from the interview.
    It should be : I see no pararel assumption to your ending from the interview.)

    @Ardea
    Reality sure is harsh… That Evi– I mean Kawamori is not Yuki Kaori… If this were Yuki Kaori series, I sure would have known the ending ^^;

    OT: After re-reading Angel Sanctuary, Isn’t it should be Alexiel, not Mika? The one who have that “kill=love” scenario with Lucifer is certainly one of the twins, righto? In any case, ALEXIEL FTW! <3 (But then why do I get the feeling that I will regret continuing this series? -.-;)

    @VF-25 Messiah
    Don’t worry, the translation is mainly correct. Hell, it IS correct without doubt. Context-wise however, is still ambiguous… Since it is the “ai”… (Goddamn it, this word again… How many times do I have to kill myself now so that I can avoid AMBIGUOUS meaning in this again?! First Incestuous misunderstanding… Then this… Then that… And now Macross…asdfghjkl;!@#$) If Kawamori use the more romantic specific word, then I will not have my brain died now…

    As for “aishiteru”… Must agree, though Kawamori must have to resort using that word in order to make the fans convinced that the triangle has been resolved. *sigh*

    Kagami
    Reply

  140. @Kagami
    Oh, I was never really worried about it being incorrect. I’ve enough confidence in my moonspeak to be sure that it isn’t. I was mostly concerned with typing down what was being said, rather than ponder much about what was meant. Of course, I did the latter as well, but I’m leaving those musings out. It’s still somewhat ambigious dialouge, and japanese is by nature a ambigious language, especially to low-context language speakers like us in the west. By the more romantic specific word, I presume you mean koi?

    And I think it can be shown, rather than told, and I’m leaning towards that being more likely as to happen. Provided we even get a non-ambigious end…

    VF-25 Messiah
    Reply

  141. @VF-25 Messiah
    That is what is hard when it comes to Japanese : It is sometimes very hard to translate to English-mostly because it has large range of meaning in one word i.e. ‘Kaze’ which can be translated as wind or cold sickness. English has quite detailed definition, and it even has slight yet totally different meaning in each words/vocabularies. And if Japanese were not an ambiguous language, how did ‘Tantei Conan’ games get created? ^^; I swear I was already having trouble explaining some language context…

    By far, I have been trying to assume it is indeed a “romantic love” for the context. However, I have some doubts since the scenes (Flashback) include Frontier. Uggh… I’m gonna have a long debate with my friends for a long time…

    Yes something like ‘koi’. If it were ‘koi’, I would not try to have any ambiguous thoughts about it. But nooooooo, by anthing, they have to do ‘ai’! >:|

    Anyway, I visited CR, and Macross F is Licensed?! No websites have ever reported it!

    Kagami
    Reply

  142. @VF-25 Messiah
    And I think it can be shown, rather than told, and I’m leaning towards that being more likely as to happen. Provided we even get a non-ambigious end…

    I do want it to be shown rather than told in words… But really, think of how will losing side shippers try to tackle the ending and try to have another possibility if any Frontier Sequel comes? As much as I enjoy eating with popcorn while watching it, I will pity mods on forums, you know^^;

    And somehow, I don’t think we are going to get ambiguous end 🙂 It is 25th anniversary to Macross series after all, and Kawamori is giving his best to revive the glory of the original Macross (though the mechs battle kinda lacking -_-;), and by now, if he is going to give any ambiguous ending, the storyline would not put so much drama in it^^ Any end, whether it’s tragic, bittersweet or happy (Leaning on the 3rd BY ALL MEANS :S) would be more meaningful than ambiguous… But it’s mainly my trained instinct rather than theory^^

    (Though it does open possibility for another near Macross Franchise P: mmmmm…)

    Kagami
    Reply

  145. @Kagami
    Don’t think we’re heading for an ambigious end either, but the risk is there. But then again this is a “chou ginga love story” so an ambigious end would almost certainly constitue some sort of failure on that part and I’m sure they realize that.

    The three corner-stones of Macross have always been music, love, and transforming mecha. All three are present in frontier, and I disagree on that the mech battles have been disappointing. Dogfights been looking stunning on my TV. Only thing I need now in the ways of Mecha is seeing the Battle Frontier transform… And seeing the koenig in battroid mode wouldn’t hurt either.

    VF-25 Messiah
    Reply

  146. I think that Alto’s number one lover might be Frontier, actually aha~
    He pushed Ranka to sing for Frontier, and now he is ‘supporting’ a dying Sheryl to sing for Frontier too…

    Still rooting for Sheryl but I’d really have to be blind not to see that things are going bad for her: she is dying, and at this point I really wonder what kind of miracle cure Kawamori could come up with that wouldn’t look to ‘forced’ or rushed.
    On the other side, I don’t understand why she is treated so badly: no family, disastrous childhood, never been loved, her popularity as songstress taken away by Ranka (she is back on track now only because Ranka is gone and because of the effects of the VVirus), incurable disease, used like a tool by Grace since the start, suspecting that Alto only loves Ranka and psychologically preparing herself to go down singing…It’s just too much! o__O

    Killing her after pushing her to the pit of despair would be too much, there should be something positive in stock for her, and I can only think of Alto -___-;; Because saving her life alone wouldn’t be ‘enough’, even putting her back as songstress wouldn’t, since it would just like going back to square one, while there must be development in her life and character; even her singing now with more emotion is due to her feelings to Alto (just like Ranka ^^).

    In the end, what I might have liked best was Yasaburo suggesting that Alto is an actor at heart who acts whatever roles he wants. That was a good one!!

    Sherry
    Reply

  147. @VF-25 Messiah
    Risk is still there, but it’s only 1-5%. I’ll put my 5% bet on Kawamori leaving an ambiguous end if he decide to kill Sheryl in Episode 25 (She has way too many Death Flags that I’m considering reversal trick, but with Kawamori… You never know), with Ranka and Alto shown beside each other without any confirmation end. No wai he has the balls to make their fans rage without clear resolution, especially if Pairing Wars ensues like this in every corner of the net-world ^^;

    It’s not that it is disappointing, dogfights in MF is AMAZING imo (not that it can top Zero though ), it’s just the quantity of mech pronz that need to be increased ^^; We need more Mechas Battles, K Kawamori? ^^ Battle Frontier will make appearance and transform (my prediction is on the next episode… Along with Triangle twister again D: I also have feeling that Yousei Full is going to be sang somewhere in Ep 24 )… And we all are waiting to see it with all of our hearts, of course 🙂 I myself want to see VF-25 back^^; VF-171EX is cool, but love VF-25 design more!

    Anyways, I have a very funny instinct that pairing wars is gonna ensues tomorrow and on episode 24. Wanna watch the pairing wars? *Gives Popcorn*

    Kagami
    Reply

  148. @Kagami

    I never really felt risk of Sheryl dying. It’s as unthinkable as Alto actually killing Ranka, despite how Sakurahime played out…

    If I were to complain just a little, I would mention stock footage, but if you look at the last macross tv-series, there’s both far less of them, and they’re of far better quality. Just I can do without seeing the same little poor vajra getting blown up again for the 8th time. Transformation of the BF is coming, no way he’d make it opening only (but then again he might get back at the fans who were complaining that the Battle Seven always had to transform to fire its gun :P)Oh and I’m convinced my namesake will come into the focus again. Why would constitute a spoiler, so I’ll leave that out…

    Pairings wars… it’s gonna be a long 2 weeks to the finale ^^;; I do like popcorn though.

    VF-25 Messiah
    Reply

  151. @Kagami
    Rather than allusion to Sakura-Hime (Aye, Queen… Heh…), I would love Alto play the Sakura Hime Kabuki for the finale XD Surely, they did not just show it for background show, rite? RITE??? (Is in denial)

    Not to mention some episode with poor art Quality :/ But hey, it still has the story, so my complain just got thrown out of the window 😀

    Oh, Don’t worry… *snigger* My intuition can be called “near perfect” for some reason :3 What I predict to happen, have already happened (NC not being used in AxS “rejection” or as supermove, Michel’s death, Klan’s increasing role… Etc.) So, Battle Frontier Transformation, here we come~

    Way to tease, me VF-25 Messiah. >:( *stare at your user name* Do want… P:

    Pairings wars… it’s gonna be a long FUN 2 weeks to the finale ^^;; I do like popcorn though.

    Fix’d! 😀 *hands popcorn for two weeks* Here you go!

    Kagami
    Reply

  153. I´m reposting here what Musouka wrote in the Romance thread on AnimeSuki. I really think it is a good perspective, so here goes:

    By Musouka:
    After allowing the latest episode to sink in, these are my thoughts as the triangle stands now.

    This last episode was hard to watch. I think it strengthened the Sheryl/Alto ship, but it’s sort of like the last few episodes of the original Macross where you feel like you’re on an emotional roller coaster. Pretty soon, you don’t really care if it crashes as long as it finally ends.

    So, why do I think this episode strengthens Alto/Sheryl? Well, let’s look at it from a narrative perspective.

    For one, let’s look at how this last episode has defined Ranka and Sheryl in their relationship to Alto. Ranka didn’t really spend much time thinking about Alto this episode. Granted, that is slightly difficult considering the situation she’s in, but were they setting up a romantic link between the two, this should have been the episode where their feelings were in sync, even though they’re far away from one another. We should have had a quiet moment of Ranka longing for Alto’s warmth despite herself, to go along with Alto’s ruminations of the nature of his and Ranka’s relationship.

    On the contrary, this episode sets them up for further separation. The most important thing to me about Alto’s talk with Klan concerning Ranka was a sense of sort of bittersweet wistfulness. As I said in the last thread, Ranka was playing the role of Hikaru. In this episode, it’s Alto who finally steps into Hikaru’s shoes (meaning he “grows up”) and realizes that, in his immaturity, he feigned blindness to Ranka’s feelings in order to continue a relationship that made himself feel good. Whether or not Ranka needed his protection isn’t really the point, it’s that Alto felt like he needed to protect someone, and he chose Ranka to project those feelings upon as an escape from his own emotions and duties.

    Alto, allowing himself to acknowledge that he might have to kill Ranka, is also letting go of her as an image. Is that the right choice? I can’t say, but it is a choice Alto made after looking at all the facts at his disposal, and looking at what he felt was the most important thing at the time. This is exactly the same thing Ozma and Ranka did. Their choices might turn out poorly too–perhaps the people SMS left behind will die a painful death at the hands of the Vajra, and this episode proved that just because Ranka wants peace doesn’t mean it’s going to come to her for the price of a simple song–but the point is that people have to make these choices. They have to do what they think is best instead of closing their eyes to the world and pretending everything will work out the way they want it to regardless.

    Now, looking at Sheryl in this episode, there are a few things. The big points about Sheryl at this moment in time are her death and her relationship with Alto. This episode almost beats you to death with the idea that Sheryl’s “dreams” are actually quite “small”. While right now, Ranka might be wishing for peace with all her might, deep down, what Sheryl wants most is love. That is why an ending where she “dies a hero” doesn’t work, and “lives and sings” doesn’t work either. Alto is being set up as what would make Sheryl happier than anything else in the world. The tension comes from the fact that Alto isn’t an object you can just “hand” over to Sheryl to make her content–there has to be genuine emotion on Alto’s part as well.

    You see, if Sheryl is the ultimate loser of the triangle, there is really no need to beat her up so hard. Most of the time, losers are allowed to retain some dignity, whereas right now, Macross F seems to be mostly interested in emotionally flagellating Sheryl to the point where it’s painful to watch as a viewer. And, this can’t really be compared to Minmay’s subplot near the end of Macross in the slightest. Minmay was being punished because of her own inability to grow up, whereas all Sheryl’s punishments are due to a fate beyond her control. Sheryl’s role is more like Misa–who was not responsible for any of the suffering she went through (aside from choosing a wishy-washy guy in the first place. )

    So basically, the anime is systematically closing off all other routes to Sheryl’s happiness, except Alto. It doesn’t make sense to have Sheryl go through all that emotional pain only to have Alto end up with Ranka after they’ve both mutually moved beyond one another, and, a little bit closer to Sheryl’s own maturity.

    Magnus
    Reply

  154. i’m neither for altoxranka or altoxsheryl … alto doesn’t deserve both of them with his indecisiveness. First, i was for Altoxranka because i hated sheryl and i thought those two looked cute together. But later on, Sheryl and Alto seemed a lot better together, the romantic scenes between them were promising. The mature pairing was a lot better in my opinion and i would have been statsfied if they ended up together (although it would break rankas and my ranka-fangirlie heart ;_;).
    Now my patience for Altos teenager-behaviour is used up.
    I’m not a big Macross fan but … blergh =_= this development makes me a bit sick.

    (… deep inside myself i’m still thinking altoxsheryl will happen… even though i don’t know how xD they are a lot better together >_>)

    Shibun
    Reply

  156. It seems like Musouka’s and my POV both coincide in one point: Sheryl is being hurt and ‘flagellated'(quoting Musouka) a bit too much in those last episodes…to a point it’s getting suspicious.

    Sherry
    Reply

  157. @kagami
    I never said Alto doesn’t care about Sheryl, what I was saying is that, Alto cares more about Ranka compared to Sheryl. He cares about both girls, but he cares more for the other one. I’ve never seen Alto stopped caring about Ranka ever since episode 1. There was no indication that she became less important to him. I see his confession to Klan congruent as to why he had always welcomed Ranka so much. He wouldn’t do that if she wasn’t special.

    I wonder if I really have to bring up point by point my reasons for stating this to avoid being called bias because I believe I’ve written it down one too many times. However, I’m going to say this, Sheryl will not get this much attention from Alto if it weren’t for her sickness.

    Regarding the newtype interview, it’s this:
    Show Spoiler ▼

    ani_d
    Reply

  158. @westlo
    lol I can’t believe you’re still waiting for innocent green. That’s so OST 1. x_x I’m pretty sure they’re going to go dokun dokun in episode 25 with or without your innocent green. And you just can’t let go of True Tears, aren’t you? You seem to think that the True Tears’s director is Kawamori. =)

    ani_d
    Reply

  160. @ani_d
    In that aspect you are wrong. It is apparent that in the show it has already been shown as both girls being precious for him. Ranka is special, so is Sheryl. He haven’t specifically stated that Ranka is special to him more than Sheryl. All we know is that Ranka is special. But what about Sheryl? We could not know this in all honesty, but his actions shows that he, too, thinks that Sheryl is special, with him being able to stay at her side even though he does think she is annoying at first few episodes. My stand will stay in BOTH girls are precious in the same level. ( But then, This is Macross Triangle, for Goodness Sake! Who can say that one is more precious until Evi– I mean Hory Froating Head slams the hammer of judgement? ^^; )

    I wonder if I really have to bring up point by point my reasons for stating this to avoid being called bias because I believe I’ve written it down one too many times. However, I’m going to say this, Sheryl will not get this much attention from Alto if it weren’t for her sickness.

    … I give up. The fact that he actually cares that Sheryl is sick is one of the proof that he indeed cares about her. You really should take into account what Alto’s view of of Ranka and Sheryl personality before you try to address this point. As I don’t want to be pulled too deep into shipping wars, could anyone pick this up?

    “‘Sealing Alto’s thoughts aside, Sheryl is determined to sing to the very as proof that she’s the galaxy’s songstress.’

    As for the second paragraph, I believe it has something to do with Alto and Ranka being separated and meeting in the battlefield.”

    But let me point this out : it is too vague to decide that Sheryl’s fate would end up as Galaxy Songstress. We really don’t know whether she would be able to hold out her sickness before the war ends (I don’t want to jinx her, but as of now, we haven’t seen the cure for her… I really need Kawamori miracle now ;_;) Besides, it seems for me the entire series is setting up Ranka as the songstress rather than Sheryl… If anything, Ranka focus in the entire series points out to the fact that she will assimilate that role now… *shrugs* Wait for episode 25 and see whether Sheryl can hold it out until that time without any witchcraft medication. We’ll see. 🙂

    “If there is an end more fitting for Sheryl, I think it’s the path to becoming the Galactic Fairy once again.”

    (Case of on-ing Sheryl fan self–Since this conception is just too… Hard to be agreed)

    Sorry, but I must disagree strongly at this. If Kawamori wanted this, it means Sheryl will come back to square one with her professionalism (assuming she survived ;x;). Yes she is proud of her work and she is the one who actually reach out to the people. But is that really what makes her happy? Is that her happiness?

    It is a part of her desire, but along the series, it just becomes apparent that she only wanted to have someone she loves and be with him until the end. Episode 23 just floss this desire of Sheryl in the dinner scene, with the orphan flashback and focuses on things…

    I really can’t see Sheryl’s happiness in being Galaxy Songstress… I just want one thing : For everyone in the series to know and reach their true happiness. And by now, the one who needs that happiness the most is actually Sheryl. Like a lot people pointed out, She just have suffered too much that even a lot of the viewer actually can’t bear to see this anymore and her love for Alto is the only thing she have and need at this point. She loves to sing, but she really don’t need to do it anymore, for the love of God! It’s just frustrating for us the fans to see her doing her very best even though she HAS LOST EVERYTHING and ANYTHING POSSIBLE, excepting that she got her popularity back, albeit in a whole lot smaller extent. But really, does that popularity even matter when she is jet-coastering to her very own death? Besides I don’t see her entirely happy for being popular-she is more grateful when her song can finally help people. SO what about her desire and wish? That girl really needs to be able to express her feeling more to Alto…

    I have to agree with most Sheryl’s supporters post that she actually have suffered too much by now. Ranka, too, have been suffering. But the one who have been smashed to what we can say next to nothing, is Sheryl by far. Comparing their situation is unfair, but really, I don’t even think anyone can say in straight face that Ranka’s suffering would be greater than Sheryl now. At least Ranka still get something (Family), but what about Sheryl? Singing does not count, since that is just more tragic to see her clinging to what she thinks makes her very own existence. Her happiness path is completely and utterly closed to one path only…

    (/Sheryl fan mode)

    “She doesn’t need someone staying with her out of pity if you ask me.”

    Alto specifically said that? O_o What we know from the Ep. 23, is that Sheryl assumes that Alto is pitying her. What about Alto? He just state he initially want to protect Ranka and Klan saying his “love”. This episode does not have any explicit indication that he stayed with her out of pity nor he stayed with her not because of pity. Alto’s decision to stay with Sheryl has not been explained clearly, K? Director-san wants to keep you in the dark for now… And holy, you are dancing in his hand and fingers (^^;)

    Kagami
    Reply

  162. @kagami+ani_d

    “If there is an end more fitting for Sheryl, I think it’s the path to becoming the Galactic Fairy once again.”

    Sorry, but I must disagree strongly at this. If Kawamori wanted this, it means Sheryl will come back to square one with her professionalism (assuming she survived ;x;). Yes she is proud of her work and she is the one who actually reach out to the people. But is that really what makes her happy? Is that her happiness?

    It is a part of her desire, but along the series, it just becomes apparent that she only wanted to have someone she loves and be with him until the end. Episode 23 just floss this desire of Sheryl in the dinner scene, with the orphan flashback and focuses on things…

    I have to join Kagami on this, and say I strongly disagree too: I already said so in a previous post, and Kagami used the same expression, but it would really be like ‘going back to square one’ : we have to realize how both girls developed in this anime –>

    Ranka: [start]unsure and with no confidence, heavily depending on others and easily influenced, cry easily and love singing, caring and sensitive, but do not have the courage to step up and realize her dream of having a lot of people hearing her sing [end]her Love for Alto made her stronger, and while she still leans on others for support often, she started walking on her own step by step and finally, from being protected became the one protecting others with her voice. Also, following her beliefs and heart, she went as far as leaving Frontier and leave her most beloved behind to go to the vajra, putting her own safety in the line and heartbroken.

    Sheryl:[start] already a ‘grown up’ since the very start, do not count on others people supports: only in herself and her own power; hard working girl; still, while being the songstress/being proud of her work and singing with all her might, she is lacking something: Love. Which she discovers with Alto, at the same time she discovers herself, and realize her wishes are a lot more humbles and simple then she believed herself : she wants and likes to sing, but ‘being a singer’ do not define her.

    Ranka became a singer, like she wished, and many people could finally hear her sing; she went to the vajra by her own free will, leaving Alto behind while she could have seriously confessed to him and waited for his answer or even worked hard to make him love her, if he answered negatively that is.
    She also regained her memories and finally remembered her brother (even if she lost him right afterward…) and is now fighting to stop the war.
    Her true wish lies on making everyone happy.

    Sheryl lost everything she had: her singing career when downstairs while Ranka’s went up, her own existence till then was denied when Grace revealed she had only been a tool in her hand and she was totally destroyed when revealed she would die shortly, she has no happy past memories nor family/friends to cling to. Condemned to death, she desperately gripped on the sole thing she had ever done her whole life: sing till she drops.
    Her true wish is to stay forever beside the one she loves.

    A ‘happy ending’ for Sheryl is definitely not going back to square one, and have no value other then ‘being a songstress’. That said, will she have a ‘happy ending’? Will she keep on going downward and be completely crushed from start to end?

    sherry
    Reply

  163. I just want one thing : For everyone in the series to know and reach their true happiness.
    In that part I agree with you.

    We agree on both the girls suffering but not on the part where the one who needs that happiness the most is actually Sheryl. Sheryl is dying and she is suffering from that knowledge but Alto is with her. What about Ranka? She left her brother (Ozma) the only family she has and Alto (the man she loves). Her mother and her brother was the most important people in her life when she was still a child and she thought they died that’s why she forgets them to block the pain but now that she regains her memory she remembers Brera as her brother and that he is still alive. She should be happy, but now she lost her brother and in that separation she knows she could lose him again. One person who promised to protect her at the cost of his life may have forgotten about her again. The one man she loves is willing albeit reluctantly to kill her if needs arises. Her dream of stopping the war is crumbling and she’s once again being thrown at the middle of it where each side is willing to use her.

    Her happiness path is completely and utterly closed to one path only…
    Ranka doesn’t have any path to follow to gain happiness. At this point all her roads leads to more pain and sufferings. If I may ask, who needs happiness the most?

    druid
    Reply

  164. Finally saw the subbed episode: forget about AltoxSheryl and AltoxRanka! Alto, become my bride!! Your cooking is pure art!! XD
    The part with the trainees asking Alto if he is dating Sheryl is cute: I liked how Alto started making up a silly ‘legend’ about it 😀 And no, I do not think him not answering is the same as a ‘yes’, there was absolutely no such attend in this scene.
    Sheryl asked him again to stay with her, and he answered yes once again, but yeah, not much romance in there x__x
    In the whole, it gave me an ominous feeling for Sheryl ^^;;; Is it all sympathy?
    I won’t change anything I wrote above, I still strongly believe Sheryl’s happiness isn’t in being a songstress, but if she doesn’t end up with Alto, I can only predict a sad end for her…
    My fav sentence : “You are an actor by nature. You perform the act desired from you for that moment. You perform it.
    So in the last 2 episodes, we will see the real Alto, behind the mask of actor.

    Sherry
    Reply

  165. I’ve just seen the subs. I…I feel like singing XD Peacefully.

    Bokutachi no negai wa daijoubuuuu, utagai no ko-to wa mou iranai! tokini jama saretatte daijoubuuu, mou nidotoooo hanarenaiiii

    anata no otooo DOKUN DOKUN DOKUN~~~

    *sigh* Alto. ^_______________________^ Like you can kill the reason you ever fought for.

    diva
    Reply

  166. [sorry for double posting]
    It’s funny: Alto ran away from acting but, in the end, he had been acting all the time, all along…

    @druid:

    I do not believe in things like “that person deserves happiness more then that one because xxx”, so I can’t answer to your question either, which is close in sens.
    I only wanted to make a point that after all this episodes, it should be rather clear that Sheryl is not only a singing puppet and her happiness is not lying in her songs. Sheryl is more then just the Galaxy Songstress.

    Sincerely, from this episode, I think things are going even more downward for Sheryl, I might even go as far as saying that she has pretty good reasons to think he is only acting by pure sympathy toward her, but again, if he is acting, how is the ‘real’ Alto’ around Sheryl? Also, having so much misfortune piling on her her is plain suspicious. Will she be crushed to the very end and go down smiling?

    As for Ranka *sigh* I was disappointed: I was looking forward having her finally act out and do something positive, but in the end, she returned to be the damsel in distress with everyone rushing to her death to save her.
    The best I can say at this point, is that she had very honest and pure intentions, but obviously not the power to comply with what she wanted.
    She is an idealist and a dreamer: thinking that just by going there and singing would resolve everything and stop the war showed, again, that she is not that grown up just yet. Will she be helpless to the very end?

    Sherry
    Reply

  167. I think both girls need to find happiness, but the fact that one had it harder than the other is entirely subjective. Because while other people think that Sheryl has it harder, my pick is no doubt Ranka because if things will go as it is right now, Ranka will be the first one to die than Sheryl.

    Ranka is misunderstood by everyone, even Alto. Alto did not abandon Sheryl. He chose to abandon Ranka for Frontier. The whole frontier sees Ranka as a traitor. Leon and Bilrer sees Ranka as a traitor.(A handful of ‘audience’ feel like they’re one of the Frontier people and sees Ranka as a traitor too =_=;) Grace and Galaxy see Ranka as a tool. As sherry noted, Ranka’s an idealist and this turn of events is like another slap in the face for her. Now that she knows her connection with the Vajra (being connected to them as a part of a whole), the chances of her committing suicide with the Vajra is pretty high, especially if the Vajra goes berserk on Frontier for self-defense. Who is Ranka’s realistic support system right now? Only Ozma.

    So as things stand, Ranka’s deathflags are really high, way higher than Sheryl. Alto decided to kill Ranka in an inevitable worst case scenario. Frontier will want to obliterate the Vajra (w/c of course includes her since they’re connected). And Ranka will most likely want to kill herself should the Vajra goes too far. I can’t see Ranka sitting there and crying as her Vajra tear up Frontier like in 14. With the story looking constantly at her character growth, the possibility of her sacrificing a LOT is almost a sure thing. Afterall, you can’t have the story’s main plot revolving ‘mostly’ around you and have it easy in the end. That would be boring. ^.^

    @sherry
    What is wrong about being back to where you first started? =) It’s not really square one because Sheryl has seen what it’s like to be at the bottom, and going back up again with a new perspective is definitely a good scenario for her.

    But yes, this episode has Alto’s charming points shooting up and up for me. ^_^ Brera even. I swear Alto can do anything but beat up another guy in a brawl. I wonder if Luca can beat him too.

    @kagami
    “You really should take into account what Alto’s view of of Ranka and Sheryl personality before you try to address this point.”

    I do. ^_~

    “Alto’s decision to stay with Sheryl has not been explained clearly, K? Director-san wants to keep you in the dark for now… And holy, you are dancing in his hand and fingers (^^;)”

    Well, Sheryl herself can feel it. She knows it. The dinner looks so forced. There was more than enough evidence in the episode to conclude that it was indeed pity–from Sheryl and Yasaburo. But yes, Alto did not say outloud that he pitied her so I’ll leave it at that. And yes, I guess I am dancing on Kawamori’s palm if that’s what you want to believe. I don’t want to argue anymore since I really don’t want to put more people on the defensive. ^^;

    @diva
    I’m merely waiting for Anata no Oto to play as Alto goes back to a screaming RANKAAAAAAAAA idiot lol! That would be adorable.

    ani_d
    Reply

  168. I can’t believe that people are already stating that Ranka’s and SMS’s choice of not following the main way of Frontier (more like “Dictator in Disguise” Leon’s way if you ask me) will not work at some point and is destined to fail.

    It’s Macross people, things may not look bright but at the end it never did in Macross when they follow the path that doesn’t consider wiping out a whole race something acceptable, Or should we mention how badly things were for the Original Macross before going to the final battle against Bodolza alone and with Minmei’s Song. Their chances were extremely low yet, it was that or complete erradication of what remained of manking, and yet the Cultural Shock (And the survival instinct in the series because of Bodolza killing anybody that was affected by Culture) Prevailed and got a massive support from Many Zentran and Meltran, while Bodolza was defeated.

    The least you can do here, is to forget that, in Macross, following a path of ony destruction doesnt’ end well, and to make matters worse, we have a Dictator in Disguise guiding that path.

    Destroying the Vajra won’t solve the problem that Leon is and Neither the Problem that Grace is. Somehow finding a way to coexist with them, or with a great deal of them while wipping out o a negative and blockminded “Mastermind” of them, will sure lead to fucking up Leon’s and Grace’s plans.

    What really matters now is to find more about the Core of the Vajra (there has to be one for sure and i think that Ranka is there) and somehow overcome the odds to bring peace and defeat the notorious conspirative Masterminds, Leon and Grace (and maybe Queen Vajra if she doesn’t turn out quite cooperative and may be as destructive minded as Leon.)

    Za Third
    Reply

  169. What is it more than Galaxy Songstress?
    I think she’s just a v-virus infected woman that sings (or do anything) for her pride and fame.

    .. and Alto’s new classmate that come out of blue. She do anything just to stick with Alto. 😉

    sng
    Reply

  170. @ani_d
    Sheryl does have it harder emotionally, because all her problems are staring her in the face, boxing her in. Ranka isn’t on the Frontier, so she doesn’t have to deal with anyone calling her a traitor. She’s not faced the potential destruction of her home and loved ones day in and day out without escape. She has no idea that Frontier can no longer sustain itself and that people are forced to wear oxygen masks in the street. She escaped being used as a tool of the military, and had the choice to try to stop the war in her own way–whereas Sheryl knows she’s being used and will be tossed aside when she dies, but does it any way to defend the people on board. And Sheryl doesn’t just have death flags, she has miniature Vajra gnawing at her brain as we speak. Furthermore, she’s convinced that the man she loves is only staying by her side out a misplaced sense of pity, and she’s currently too weak not to accept whatever scraps of kindness he offers. Ranka hasn’t even so much as thought about Alto since episode 21.

    I mean, I’m really not trying to downplay the courage Ranka’s choice took, or the fact that she’s currently in dire straits, but if you try to set up her as somehow more tragic than Sheryl at this point in time, you’re ridiculous. Sheryl has had everything taken from her, Ranka has chosen to nobly leave everything behind to find a source of the problem. The issue is that one has had a choice, and the other is being tossed around by fate, desperately trying to regain her footing.

    Likewise, if the idea that Sheryl would be happy just walking away as a singer is ludicrous. The entire point of this episode was setting that singing is what she will do, but what would make her happy are warm times with her loved one. If Sheryl dies, or is forced to make yet another sacrifice against her own happiness and give up Alto, how could you not have a bitter taste in your mouth even if the end result is Ranka/Alto? I don’t understand how shipping can override everything to the point of accepting another character’s misery as long as your “ship” sails. When Ranka was left on Frontier as Alto flew off with Sheryl on his birthday, I felt terrible for her. I’d rather have a resolution where everyone manages to be happy instead of sacrificing a character on the altar of “romance”.

    musouka
    Reply

  171. @musuoka
    Atleast Sheryl’s love of her life isn’t planning on killing her. 😉 Like I said, whether Sheryl or Ranka had it harder than the other is subjective so I’ll keep my arguments to myself. I’m just saying I can see Sheryl letting go of Alto because it would be so demeaning knowing that someone is just staying with you out of pity. Who says she won’t end up happy by cutting Alto off? ^_~

    That’s what I like about Sheryl. Her world will not crumble without a guy. More than Alto, she really values her song. It’s her Pride. She called it “the proof of her living.” It’s just us assuming that Sheryl will fall apart if she lets go of Alto. Mind you, Alto decided that he will stay by Frontier’s side—which also includes being with Sheryl till her last moments, so it’s not Alto that’s going to leave Sheryl in the long run. It will be Sheryl. Whether we like her to let go of Alto or not, it’s up to her. I can’t see her torturing herself with the pity stuff till the end.

    And I don’t think we’ll see Sheryl die in this season. She can either get a cure or something to extend her life for a more realistic conclusion. Sheryl may sing Yousei next episode btw.

    ani_d
    Reply

  172. @ani_d:
    I’m just saying I can see Sheryl letting go of Alto because it would be so demeaning knowing that someone is just staying with you out of pity.

    You mean, something like “Hurry up and go after her! Don’t hesitate because of me. It’s too miserable to be receiving sympathy from you.”

    Do you know the next lines, ani_d?

    musouka
    Reply

  173. He joined SMS so that he can protect Ranka? He may have joined sms and he may have chosen sheryl but the one he loves is really Ranka. Kyaaa! I can’t stop giggling. Please change your mind later Alto-hime. Don’t kill poor Ranka! 🙁

    Manel
    Reply

  175. Alto is the reason why Ranka sings.
    Ranka is the reason why Alto fights.
    If Sheryl wasn’t on the roof there with Alto, Ranka would’ve told Alto and vice versa. They would’ve hooked up!! Ranka wouldn’t have to call on the song of destruction at the sight of Alto/Sheryl. Michael didn’t have to die?? *GASP* :'(

    swtpnay
    Reply

  177. You know Ani_d it doesn’t matter what OST is was placed on, I mean there’s a couple songs from the first Geass R2 ost that haven’t been used yet, guess they won’t be used than since ther’s 2 eps to go yeah *rolleyes* Also it’s a FACT and not an opinion that the second half of Innocent Green hasn’t been used yet, you think they did a triumphant reprise of the first half of an Alto and Sheryl bgm for nothing?

    You’re also really taking that Newtype line out of context, the interview from her VA in Aya Endo about Sheryl’s feelings in the FINAL episode say different. That line you seem to think has bearings on Sheryl’s future seems to be something that she is thinking right now. Did you not watch her scene with Luca in the hospital? She refuses to take the medicine which could halt the progress of her disease so that her fold waves could become stronger as her disease gets closer to claiming her life. She already made this choice before falling under the impression that Alto is staying with her out of pity, which is something she suspected as you can see by her talk with Luca, about how not to pity her because she’ll take advantage of that kindness.

    I don’t know why you’re taking the line as proof that it’s going to be a Galactic Fairy ending for Sheryl. When it’s clear the line of thinking for her is because thinks she’s going to die, so she’s going to prove her greatness as a singer in sacrificing herself for the sake of the Frontier fleet and it’s people. She thinks her love for Alto is unrequited and so this is all she has left and now after the end of 23 she also mistakenly thinks Alto is staying with her out of pity.

    Also the Galactic Fairy ending is moronic since it erases a lot of character development for the 3 people involved in the triangle, also how could you even read the lyrics for Northern Cross and Yousei/Fairy and even think Sheryl would be happy giving up on Alto to return to what she was doing before the series started? Didn’t the bridge bunnies and Elmo make it obvious to you that her songs have changed? Here’s some lines from it…

    Ever since I met you, I have been quivering in love,

    Will I ever find in this universe a place of warmth
    a place for our endearment and dreams

    I yearn for you. I fly to the four corners of earth
    enduring the rain, like the torment of a thousand whips

    Believe in me (I want to be by your side)
    With all my heart, I’m loving you
    The way you untie your hair
    like a rainbow oozing out its beauty

    In the hope of finding someone, in the hope of finding love
    I have been alone till now
    Standing between the past and the future
    I yearn for watching the twilight of this galaxy by your side

    Don’t tell me after you read those lyrics you think Sheryl would give up on Alto if she had a choice. Atm she doesn’t think she has a choice since she is dying, so she’s going to seal up her emotions for Alto and do what she can, and that is to sing for Frontiers sake. Note that sealing ones emotions is not giving up which is what Ranka did with Alto in episode 21.

    Also I can’t believe you’re spinning the somewhat forced atmosphere of the dinner scene to being based on pity. If Sheryl cutting her finger on a knife and not letting Alto go near the blood didn’t give you a hint than surely Alto looking at the case of pills while Sheryl slept and his comment about her ooc behaviour did? Oh wait no they didn’t because you have Ranka glasses on, he was probably thinking about Ozma’s words and Ranka leaving throughout the entire dinner, yeah that’s right has to be it!

    “You seem to think that the True Tears’s director is Kawamori. =)”

    He isn’t but you’re silly not to think that the original Macross hasn’t had an influence on other triangles throughout the years from Kimagure Orange Road to True Tears.

    Westlo
    Reply

  178. some cross posted tl;dr goodness from AS…

    This isn’t really aimed at anyone in particular but I think the tough thing when it comes to shipping is that its easy to try to justify that he’s only got feelings for one girl; if you’re shipping Sheryl he’s only interested with Ranka as a ‘little sister,’ if you’re shipping Ranka he’s just with Sheryl right now out of pity. I don’t believe either one is true… and I think Alto’s actions have spoken clear as day and we’re starting to see the culmination of that. Admittedly, though… I only really started to connect the dots after his confrontation with Michael… “it’s a crime to be as dense as you.” Michael knows that Alto is relatively aware; he’s just trying to let him have the benefit of the doubt to some extent.

    I’ll talk about Ranka a bit first; simply because alot of people seem taken aback by the fact he acknowledged feelings for her. Aside from a big *duh* no offense, all the stuff that he said in 23 was pretty much spelled out for us in the first 4 or 5 episodes. He demanded to know more about her, and he flat out said he wanted to protect her. That was a huge part of his rationale for joining SMS. I think it’s dangerous to say he used her as a crutch for “running away” though, although I think there’s some truth to that. It’s on par with saying Ranka is “needy” or relying on Alto’s support, or that it’s just a crush. The thing is, they’re not mutually exclusive… Ranka and Alto were reliant on each other’s support. They really brought out the best in each other, in a sense.

    This is a bit of a slippery slope I’m going down; and I am a big fan of the AxS pairing… but for very, very different reasons than most. First and foremost… I know alot of people hinge on their banter… and I do see chemistry in it… but I see it as being very, very dark. If Alto and Ranka are bringing out each other’s potential; initially Alto and Sheryl are bringing out the skeletons in each other’s closets. There are times when Alto borders on just being cruel… and Sheryl comes off as coy and indifferent. But I see this as Alto just being confused about how he feels about both her and Ranka, and Sheryl just not wanting to admit how much she wants, and maybe even needs this. It’s just compounded by the fact they’re always together for a stretch from 8-12 or so.

    Anyway, back to Alto… chronologically we have the first 4 or so episodes where he’s all “garrrrr… Ranka!!!” and then 5 through 7 or 8 where he warms up to Sheryl. In episode 8 though… and I’m sure people in both camps would disagree with me… he just shuts down. He’s indifferent to Ranka coming to Mihoshi, and he is just doesn’t want to be involved when it comes to Sheryl. This isn’t necessarily someone who doesn’t have feelings for either girl, this is someone who’s overwhelmed. By how close they are now to him, by the decision he knows he has to make… I mean take your pick, but it’s probably all of the above.

    I’ve gotten into it with people on IRC, but I think between 11 and 15 he really means to “choose” Ranka. The way he lets her “in” during 12 and 13, the fact he takes her with him to see Sheryl in the hospital, and a few more things that seem to imply he’s made his decision. I’ve been called out on what the catharsis is that makes him “change his mind” and I can’t really say. Maybe it was the sing-off, maybe it was the fact Sheryl was still sick… honestly I’m not looking at external factors. But Alto’s tick or tell is that he’ll go from warm to… indifferent, or even pissy pretty quickly. I tend to lean towards the opinion that he couldn’t bring himself to let go of Sheryl, but it could be a number of other things. It could have been the plateau for AltoXRanka, and he saw the writing on the wall or… I don’t know. I’ll come back to this one when the series ends.

    Anyway FF a few episodes, we get Alto climbing up to Ranka’s room, Michael calling Alto, Alto… finally warming up to Sheryl. Ranka walking in on Alto hugging Sheryl, and finally Ranka’s “I loved you… I wish it could have been like this forever…” goodbye. And of course Alto’s “I’ll be with you… until the end!”

    First and foremost that’s not something you say out of pity, in Japanese, English, Cantonese, Spanish, Gaelic, French Canadian, Navajo, Basque, or whathaveyou. One of the spoilers said something along the lines of “…but is this true love?” and technically it is a valid question. I was telling someone last week I expected Sheryl to keep Alto at arm’s length (the implication in 23 is that she really feels he’s doing this from pity) and Alto would probably have to deal with some lingering feelings regarding Ranka. I’m not a huge fan of speculating though, and this is some stuff that I’d rather take up after the series ends. But let me kind of sum up how I see AltoXRanka vs. AltoXSheryl.

    I don’t think Alto’s feelings towards Ranka are brotherly, first and foremost. I think it’s a cop out to say so; and as I said previously I think it’s a mutual support they give each other. But… I think to a degree they fell in love with each other’s potential, rather than as people. I think in a huge way they brought out each other’s potential, but I am kind of in agreement with the consensus that they never really got to know each other well enough. I don’t think that’s because he was a crush to Ranka, or that Alto was using her as a crutch… really, it’s just the nature of the beast in a relationship like that. The focus is on what will be, or what can be, as opposed to what is… and the line between inspiration and detriment is really pretty slim.

    As far as Alto and Sheryl are concerned… I think… hrm. I think it comes down to meeting the right person, at the wrong time? Alto could see beyond his past, beyond the acting, fame, etc. in that he met Ranka and became a pilot because of her. And Sheryl was probably perfectly content as Sheryl Nome, galactic fairy, the street urchin turned idol. Again that’s kind of why I don’t like their early banter; there is chemistry there but it comes off as unstoppable force vs. immovable object. Sheryl’s persistence vs. Alto’s reluctance… the thing is Sheryl doesn’t really open up and Alto just plays along, so it comes off like a cat chasing it’s own tail.

    No offense, but I don’t see much slow + steady development in this… I really see Alto seemingly decide to go in the other direction. But the nature of a relationship like that is that it lingers… regardless of being in the completely opposite direction of where one thinks they should or want to be. The drawback right now being the baggage that they find themselves with.

    The big question now is where they all go from here. I don’t really feel like speculating too much, but… there’s Ranka… who confessed her love on the way to deep space. Alto, who told Sheryl he’d stay by her side until the end. And Sheryl, who right now feels Alto is only with her out of pity. (shojo Frontier FTW, btw.)

    There was a huge criticizm of Ranka in 20 because… she only sang for Alto. And now, in 23, we have Alto… who fought, who flew… for Ranka! What does this mean?!?!!?! Maybe he felt like she did give him something to run away to, but he just kept running… even away from her. He’s not running anymore; though. Not from Sheryl, and whatever feelings may be there, from Frontier, from his family. But he’s made his choices this time, and he’s standing by them. What comes of that, we shall see… but… he’s come a long, long way.

    stray
    Reply

  180. This is my first time posting here but I’ve been following this series since the start and reading most of the comments on this blog.

    So, the shippers are now scouring song lyrics… Great. I’m not in favor of either Ranka or Sheryl. It would be better if Alto doesn’t end-up with anyone the way things are going. It’s an anime series, the logic of real life won’t apply. In the end, it’s all down to the creators of the series and we’re just along for the ride. Best thing to do is just enjoy the ride and not make too many assumptions 🙂

    Lyrics-wise though, it’s leaning toward Sheryl (Northern Cross & Yousei). It would be nice though, if people would stop using the original Macross to analyze the triangle in MF. I liked Misa and was rooting for her from the start. I can’t say the same for either Sheryl or Ranka. I think the death card’s gone into cliche, Kimi ga Nozomu Eien territory (even though Haruka didn’t have terminal illness, it’s giving the same feeling). Until I hear Alto say “suki da” to someone, I’ll leave the speculations at the door. I just want to see more VFs in action and a nice, conclusive ending…

    fallenazazel
    Reply

  184. @druid
    Ranka doesn’t have any path to follow to gain happiness. At this point all her roads leads to more pain and sufferings. If I may ask, who needs happiness the most?

    Then may I ask, what do you think is Ranka’s happiness? We know that we can infer Sheryl’s from her past and all, but actually, it is kinda hard for me to perceive Ranka’s happiness. For now, I will take into account the opinion of someone who know her the most : Megumi Nakajima, her seiyuu. For Megumi, Ranka’s happiness is when people are happy. She is happy when she finally is able to bring peace and smile to people’s face.

    I do want Ranka to be happy, but let’s take a little look to the anime first : “What is Ranka’s happiness?” This one needs to be cleared up first. ani_d, druid, diva, and yuKime, as Ranka’s fans, what do you think of it firstly?

    @ani_d
    “You really should take into account what Alto’s view of of Ranka and Sheryl personality before you try to address this point.”

    I do. ^_~
    Then explain. Don’t just say I do. What do you think of Alto’s view of Ranka and Sheryl and how it affects him, Sweetie^^;

    And for the pity part… We’ll see… We’ll see. As Alto has not tell it directly/explicitly to us, I have to stand by that we do not know it yet. And what the…? The dinner scene look forced? -_-; Good luck in repelling all the arguments that is going to fly into you, ani_d.

    Sheryl may sing Yousei next episode btw.

    You know, Yousei is the only song I can consider now as LT twister source with its lyric (That’s why I predict it is going to be sung too), so you contradict your sentence that there is no more Fake-out or turning.

    @Sherry
    The part with the trainees asking Alto if he is dating Sheryl is cute: I liked how Alto started making up a silly ‘legend’ about it

    *Snigger* Ah… Sherry, watch SDF-M and you will realize that there is a scene completely pararrel to this ^^ It is not a “silly” legend, it is completely an easter egg legend XD

    @fallenazazel
    “So, the shippers are now scouring song lyrics…”

    It is exactly because Macross always have 3 major elements (Like VF-25 Messiah posted before): Music, Mecha and Love. And if anything, it is always debated that Music is the most major element that makes Macross Franchise (My thought is that every three is major). If anything, making sense of what the lyrics of the music may give you in-depth view of the character and possibility of something happening 🙂

    Kagami
    Reply

  185. @ stray

    I agree with a lot of what you said. Alto did like ranka romantically, hence why he’s always had strong protective feelings for her But as the series progresses he’s becoming increasingly drawn to Sheryl. And I think, this gradually increasing feelings for sheryl, confuses him greatly because they conflict with his earlier strong intent to protect ranka forever.

    Like you said, the alto/ranka relationship does have a more light-hearted feel to it & both alto & ranka look at their relationship as based on mutual support ( as opposed to hw most of us shippers do) but there are no serious undertones in their relationship.

    With Ranka, there was no danger of Alto ever having to face his inner demons, hence why I feel alto would have been taking the easy way out if he was ever planning on having a future with her (If ur rite abt alto deciding on ranka in ep 12-14, I dont think you are though. I think he lets her in a little there only because he already knew he liked her & with Sheryl around, he probably never got a chance to really talk to her. Now, that we know for sure that he had feelings for ranka, its interesting to note why he wasnt firmer with Sheryl & why he still hung around her when he didnt have to. I cant help but think that Sheryl has some hold on him that he cant quite shake off. I dont think her being sick had anything to do with it at all because he still hung around her even before that, all the time knowing that it was ranka he wanted to protect.).

    It also works vice-versa- With alto, ranka wont have to face her own inner demons either because If you’ll remember in Galia IV, he wrongly advices her to not try & remember her past. So, whichever way you look at it, the basis for their relationship isnt a healthy one & I can guarantee that it wont be a long lasting one either because some day they’ll have to stop running. Ranka realized this in ep 21 & alto in ep 23, IMO.

    OTOH, like you said, Sheryl & Alto force each other to bring out the skeletons in their closet which makes their relationship stronger, deeper & yes also darker in its execution. They share an amazing chemistry with very serious undertones which makes me feel that their realtionship is much more rooted in reality than A/R. They are inadvertantly forcing each other to face their inner demons & thus maybe coming out of it much stronger than before, atleast for Sheryl, we have yet to see what comes of alto’s resolution. But I have to say that everytime he spends a bit of time with Sheryl, he comes out of it with a little more maturity & insight than before.

    I also think that the intensity of such a relationship overwhelms alto & the prospect of facing his inner demons scares him, which is why he’s been more tsuntsun with Sheryl than ranka. I think he’s definitely growing out of this irrational fear though & beginning to face his demons now bit by bit.

    Also, while protecting Ranka might have been his sole reason for joining SMS initially, I think his priorities have shifted as the series progresses. His sphere of protection has widened considerably. It isnt abt ranka alone anymore. I think ep 18 is when he first begins to question his intent to protect solely her & realizes that there are other people including sheryl, that he wants to protect as well.

    And then ep 20 solidifies this belief when he asks ranka to sing for everyone’s sake, for frontier. Then ep 21, despite his self oath to protect ranka, despite not liking the idea of using ranka as bait, despite seeing that she’s not happy doing it & agrees to sing reluctantly, he still nods his head to it & asks her to sing without worrying clearly showing that his priorities have shifted such that Frontier now ranks above Ranka.

    IMO, A man would never let the woman he’s in love with be used as a bait when it was clearly written all over her face that she didnt want to do it & he knew this. To his credit , he does protest when luca mentions using her as bait, but I cannot forget that he doesnt protest when ranka says she’ll do it despite the visible hesitation/reluctance/doubt on her face. Ep 23 further confirms for us that to protect frontier, he is willing to kill Ranka.

    I dont think he was ever in love with Ranka, yes he had feelings for her, romantic feelings, but I dont think that equates to him being in love with her. He liked her but he was gradually falling in love with Sheryl, not ranka because now that we know that he’s liked her from the beginning, that means that his feelings for ranka have been more or less static throughout the series while his feelings for Sheryl have been steadily growing as the series progresses.

    aneeshadc
    Reply

  186. Is it pity?

    I don’t think that Alto staying by Sheryl’s side is pity. She is someone he cares about, whether it be love or friendship, he cares for her. Only in the next two episodes will we know if that is ‘true love’ or not.

    He knows she’s dying and he can’t do squat about it. So he feels saddened by her current state.

    If you had someone you cared about whether it be love or friendship, and that person needed you to be there for them, would you pity them or would you be saddened by their condition?

    Does anyone think the current opening scene to MF – where it appears to be Sheryl laying on the ground, being semi-bound – lowered into a dark pool have any meaning? I think it’s bizarre and may provide a brief glimpse into what may come?

    Barbwire Wings
    Reply

  187. @aneeshadc

    While Alto did go with Sheryl to Gaila 4 – leaving Ranka behind, I am uncertain if this was because he wanted to go with Sheryl to just be with Sheryl. He had two other reasons to stay. To meet Ranka at the park or to visit his father. He chose neither as enough of a reason to stay.

    After all of the hostage action on Gaila 4, Alto did not seem to think of returning to Frontier with Ranka, but Michael had to ‘guilt’ him into it. What does this mean, I don’t know. Alto’s denseness creates a fog of confusion. Dang Kawamori!

    If Alto loves Ranka, why didn’t he say anything other than “RAAANKKAAAAA!!!!” as she flew off with Brera? Why not “RANKA DON’T GO I REALLY LIKE YOU TOO!!!!” But instead he lets her fly off, perhaps to never see her again…

    If Alto loves Sheryl, why doesn’t he say anything to her as he is caring for her? He doesn’t have much time left.

    What does this all mean? I dunno. All I am certain of is Alto = dense.

    Barbwire Wings
    Reply

  188. @westlo
    Oh you are? It’s still GREATLY STUPENDOUSLY, HORRIBLY offensive being put in the same category as the Animesuki sheryl club. Animesuki? I think I almost vomited there. Joke or not. HAHAH but gracias for telling me because I’m really suffering trying to hold my laughter here.

    By the way…Yousei huh? Why did you cut some lyrics buddy? 😀 What is this all about? Can you tell me?

    I let my unrequited love
    to turn into dust with no regrets. (I want to be with you)

    HAHAHA UNREQUITED LOVE? XD Yoko Kanno for president!

    diva
    Reply

  189. @ Barbwire

    “While Alto did go with Sheryl to Gaila 4 – leaving Ranka behind, I am uncertain if this was because he wanted to go with Sheryl to just be with Sheryl. He had two other reasons to stay. To meet Ranka at the park or to visit his father. He chose neither as enough of a reason to stay.”
    I dont recall saying alto went to Galia IV because of Sheryl in my earlier post. But since you brought it up anyway, I’d say that going with sheryl knowing he had feelings for ranka, even with the prospect of an endless sky as bonus, was a pretty dick move on alto’s part, though I guess I can cut him some slack, since it was his b’day.

    This also means that his feelings for Ranka then werent strong enough & he was becoming drawn to Sheryl bit by bit. Then Ranka’s kira happened & he gets swayed by her again, then ep 5 sing off pretty much neutralizes things again. AHhhhhhh, he’s been an indecisive jerk all this time, I swear I’d punch his guts out & if I could regardless of how hot & pretty I think he is!

    I dont think alto is dense any more. He’s always been aware, he’s just been pretending not to notice & running away, like always. While I dont like, that this means that he’s been indecisive on purpose all this while for his own convenience/comfort(jerk), I can sorta sympathise with him, cos…… well, its a really hard choice & he clearly cares deeply abt both girls. Also, him knowing & being fully aware does put a really interesting spin on things. I really cant wait for ep 24 & 25 when we’ll finally get to see the real alto.

    aneeshadc
    Reply

  190. @stray
    I agree with your “meeting the right person, at the wrong time” regarding Sheryl and Alto because no matter how much of a mature woman Sheryl was over Ranka, Alto gravitates more to Ranka than her. He always look out for Ranka. For Sheryl to get his voluntary attention, galactic fairy had to be dying or fainting or obligating him. Alto just sees Sheryl as a friend and since he has love for the dead & dying, his emotion towards her doubled because of, yeah-huh, Pity. It was shown clearly in Episode 23. Sheryl knows it’s just pity. Ozma stated that Alto is just “being swept away by his emotions” in 22. Don’t you just love the writers making Ozma hit the nail on the head even without him knowing about Sheryl? 😀

    The idea of the whole scenario is that: Alto may have chosen to stay with Sheryl in Frontier. He may have chosen to kill Ranka if her Vajra homies went wild on them. But the one he loves IS Ranka and it is a very painful dilemma that Klan cried for him. Plain and simple.

    diva
    Reply

  191. Sry, Ep 15 sing- off I mean.

    Anyway, basically what I’m trying to say is that most of alto’s confusion regarding the two girls was that he probably didnt get Why Sheryl was slowly making her way into his heart when he had initially already decided to protect ranka forever. I think he’s quite clear on what & who he wants as of now, after ep 23. Soon, it’ll be clear to us too.

    aneeshadc
    Reply

  192. @all

    I take my account about Ranka or Sheryl being the Galaxy Songstress back after reading a blog. I vote for Galaxy Kabuki Alto now! Besides Episode 25 Synopsis does not declare who is that ‘Silhouette’ anyway…. :3 (is Brainwashed)

    Kagami
    Reply

  193. Ok, so in short: Grace kills Brera. Alto kills Grace, Ozma, a bunch of Vajra, half of Frontier. Canalia dies of Koenig Monster Is Too Damn Slow. Klan dies of Vajra swarm on a -Rea. The Quarter is explodified in a bigger way than the SDF-1. Bilrer goes out, screaming, “Protocultcha!” while Hikaru Ichijo blasts away with his GU-11 Gunpod… Wait… Sheryl dies of Type-V. Luca is dead within 5 minutes of the episode start, as Luke is pathetic. Nanase dies at the exact same moment… Spooky… And finally, Alto dies in a blaze of glory, killing Ranka. Then, as spirits, Sheryl AND Ranka bitchslap him and walk away. And so, our hero is left alone, dead, and, of course, naked. (This is a Japanese Space Opera Anime. They’ve got to be naked as dead people in space.)

    I feel this is too short an ending for such an epic series, as there are only 2 episodes left. Kawamori-sensei, you disappoint me, yet again. Your story is good, but lacking completely in good execution.

    Alto, you’re too indecisive.
    McDonalds: May I take your order?
    Alto: Yeah. Just a minute.
    *11.5 hours later*
    Alto: Hm, I can’t choose…
    McDonalds: Sir, we’re closed.
    Alto: RANKA!!!!!!!!!!!
    McDonalds: Seriously, we’re closed.
    Alto: Ok, then. Sheriru?
    McDonalds: WE! ARE! CLOSED!
    Alto: Kuran?
    McDonalds: LEAVE!

    And this ends my foolish, tired randomness. Thank you. This is Charlie Gibson. Good night, America.

    Schizo Mike
    Reply

  194. Sorry for the second post.

    In response to nycs’s post:
    Brera: “My little sister, you say?! Ranka?! *Thinking: Oh no… You mean… And… Z-OH MY GOD, IT WAS INCEST! I HOPE SHE’S NOT PREGNANT!*
    School nurse, about 3 weeks later: Well, Ranka, you are pregnant, but it’s not Brera’s. *Brera: WHEW!* It’s Ai-kun’s.
    Everyone in the room: 0_0
    Ozma: *Die*
    Alto: *Die*
    Everyone else: *Die*
    Grace: Really? I’m the only one not surprised? This is a Japanese Anime! Aimo’s got tentacles! It’s like 1+1=2!

    Schizo Mike
    Reply

  195. I think one of them will be sacrificed but the other one will live on most likely with Alto. From the looks of this episode Sheryl might be the sacrifice. She might die in the attempt to help Alto but that seems too obvious and predictable. We still haven’t seen what Alto’s father can do for Alto his step brother keeps on pushing him to see his father. Maybe Alto’s father has a cure for Sheryl that he is hiding from the government. Alto and Sheryl look very happy together. Maybe Ranka is the sacrifice she might of saved Alto during the Vajra battle in the next episode in the process of giving up her life but who knows.

    jbg
    Reply

  196. @ Diva

    “By the way…Yousei huh? Why did you cut some lyrics buddy? 😀 What is this all about? Can you tell me?”

    I cut some lyrics because my post was long enough as it was without posting everything else in Yousei. As for unrequited love I already explained that in my post, just because Sheryl thinks her love is unrequited in 22-24 doesn’t mean that’s the case as 25 will show you 😉

    And I told you I was RankaFan because I missed your overthetop posts which where more entertaining than what you did in this thread 🙁

    Westlo
    Reply

  198. I feel bad. Alto, I’m sorry. 🙁 All along you’ve been loving Ranka secretly too and I was libeling you all over the place for not vowing to protect Ranka. I’m horrible.

    RankaxAlto end go go go!!

    Cari
    Reply

  199. Nakamura Yuuichi: Alto’s VA from Animedia interview
    “I guarantee you that the conclusion of the love triangle will surprise everyone. Alto and I were mobbed in the recording studio!”

    Hot damn!

    HeavenlyDelirium
    Reply

  200. @diva:
    HAHAHA UNREQUITED LOVE? XD Yoko Kanno for president!

    Sigh. That line is a bit more complex than the simple 片思い you’re making it out to be. More like “if my love can’t be fufilled, that’s still fine”, to use a less poetic translation. It’s a song about loving someone without the expectation of being loved back.

    You guys in general really should pay more attention to the songs. Ranka’s “Blue Ether” is about having been close and now going through a consensual separation. It’s a tragic song of a love that “didn’t work out”. On the other hand, Yousei is about feeling far apart from someone, but desperately longing to be closer. “I must leave you” VS “I want to fly to you”.

    musouka
    Reply

  203. I’m not sure who “Anata no Oto” is for in the overall message of the series, which is why I didn’t compare the two. Here are some general thoughts:

    “Anata no Oto” is a song about being united with someone. There are many ways this can play out.

    1) It’s about Alto and Ranka, the answer of “Blue Ether”. Parting and togetherness. If you look at it a certain way, this song never got to reach Alto, so perhaps this time it does. However, the lyrics, to me don’t speak of making their way back to someone you’ve left–don’t quote the translation at me, that line is ambiguous and can be read as “I’ll never be parted from you”–so I’m not sure it quite works in the way Alto/Ranka fans would like. There’s always a chance, though.

    2) It’s a song for the Vajra. Like Aimo, it’s a song that implies “so close that we’re one”, and the Vajra did have a reaction to it. This is the theory I tentatively favor, as Ranka’s current development has been more strongly tied to Vajra than the triangle.

    3) It’s a song for Alto and Sheryl. Both times it was played in the background, Alto was focused on Sheryl, so reading it a certain way, like choice one, it’s actually “their” song. Before anyone protests Ranka singing a song for another couple, let’s keep in mind that Minmay’s “Ai, Oboeteimasuka” was actually Hikaru and Misa’s song. It also acts as an “answer” to Yousei in that Yousei is about “reaching towards someone” and “Anata no Oto” is about finally reaching someone. Still, that seems a bit too “shipper goggles” to me, so I kind of “hope but don’t expect”.

    4) A choice I just came up with right now–it’s a simple song that will be played over the end credits as we get a silent flash to all the people on the show with their various happy endings. Perhaps the most likely choice of all. :p

    musouka
    Reply

  204. This series is seriously making me dizzy..
    At the beginning of the series, I used to HATE Sheryl. She just seemed kinda annoying and selfish. But as the series progresses, she changes, and becomes the hope for all people. She actually has a meaning for all her singing. Now she’s one of my favorite characters in the series! :] And Alto..is SO NOT FLEXIBLE. He vows to kill Ranka if her song gets in the way, and the whole reason he became a soldier was to protect her. That’s just messed up..

    And I personally think that Ranka actually made a good decision. YES I WOULD PROUDLY SAY THAT SHE MADE A GOOD DECISION!! She wanted to find more about her past, and the only key to her past is the Vajra. The people shouldn’t depend on Ranka so much. (Peer pressure). I HATE it when people say how stupid she is. She has her own reasons. You guys just say she’s stupid because you don’t truly comprehend her reasonings. Everyone has a reason to do something.

    But overall, I like the Sheryl X Alto couple still XDD

    Miki
    Reply

  206. @HeavenlyDelirium

    Nakamura Yuuichi: Alto’s VA from Animedia interview
    “I guarantee you that the conclusion of the love triangle will surprise everyone. Alto and I were mobbed in the recording studio!”

    Very interesting!! ^^
    Thanks for the quote 🙂
    It actually gives me something to look forward to since, let’s be sincere, pretty much every single plots fans came up with are all far too boring, being too predictable…

    It’s either Ranka dies, or Sheryl dies, or no one dies and 1-Alto likes Sheryl and send Ranka to Hell, or 2-he loves Ranka and it’s Sheryl who got thrown to the other side of the Galaxy or, since we are at it, it might as well be neither girls…etc…
    But if Alto was ‘mobbed’ by the conclusion, is there still something else, something really no one thought of that will come out? (Ranka and Sheryl fusion, and become one person, problem resolved 😛 or better, Alto declares his undying Love for his deceased mother and reveals no girl could ever surpass his mommy :D)

    Sherry
    Reply

  208. @adam_is
    If you ask me, Anata no Oto is either about

    a) Ranka’s resolution song for Blue Ether’s sad conclusion.
    b) A song for everyone in love
    c) Ranka’s resolution song for Blue Ether’s sad conclusion AND a song for everyone (This is definitely it. It’s Ranka’s song.)

    There is no way Anata no Oto will be Ranka’s love song for the Vajra -_- Can you just imagine Ranka seranading the Vajra queen with dokun dokun dokun? I mean, just look at the lyrics? This is Ranka’s song for a CERTAIN person. It’s a resolution song of two people in love overcoming the odds.

    “The sound of love
    I can hear it waking me up
    With this hand of mind
    I wish to touch you behind your solitude
    In anticipation for the new day
    we firmly closed our eyes together    ”

    And if this is just a song about Sheryl and Alto, I’m pretty sure Yoko Kanno would’ve just written a happier Sheryl song instead of making it a Ranka song. That will be so irrelevant. Yousei is about Sheryl, yet Anata no Oto is also about Sheryl? lol Anyway, I also think the songs will tell you a lot of what kind of conclusion Sheryl and Ranka will get. I’m still hoping for a happy resolution for everyone after a suspenseful climax. It’ll be cool if everyone gets to live under a real sky. ^_^

    ani_d
    Reply

  209. I find it funny that many people are comparing the triangle here with the original Macross and DYRL triangle. IA that many of the same elements are there, two women one guy, singers, pilot, one older, one younger, etc. However can I just say that neither one of these women is as awesome as Minmay!!

    That said, I find myself more on the shipping side of Alto/Ranka than Alto/Sheryl, which I can see from other people’s comments here is an unpopular opinion. I have been waiting, these last two episodes to really see Alto’s love for Sheryl, and instead what I’ve seen is a guy trying to deal with the news that his friend is going to die and that there’s nothing he can do except promise to support her by promising to stay with her and be by her side so that she’s not alone, because remember she would be alone since she doesn’t have anyone else onboard MF who is close to her. (WOW that was a LONG sentence!)

    I found with 23 that two things about A/S stood out, one when Sheryl gets mad at Luca, she says something along the lines of “symapthy would cause me to take advantage,” and then when she hears Alto’s admission re: his feelings for Ranka, she says something like, “that’s what I thought, but just for a little while more.” IMO both of these statements reveal that Sheryl is insecure about where she stands with Alto. That’s why she hasn’t had the courage to come out and tell him how she feels. And that for me, signals that Alto is staying with her because he naturally feels bad because she’s dying.

    Regardless, I would like this series to end with the triangle resolved one way or another.

    What is more interesting to me, which not many people are discussing because of this triangle is the role of NUNS/Briler (sp) and Alto, et al. They are obviously on the wrong side of this conflict. I can’t believe that Alto would take Leon’s word for the Vajira using Ranka especially knowing why the Macross Quarter left!! That makes him look more like an idiot than anything related to the triangle. I can’t wait until he realizes that he is being played.

    I also cannot wait for the Macross Quarter people to get more face time. I want them to kick some NUNS ass!! The best part of the previous episode was the commandeering of the ship and the battle between Ozuma and Alto-tachi! I want more of that kind of action!!

    AJackBoy
    Reply

  210. @ani_d
    “Can you just imagine Ranka seranading the Vajra queen with dokun dokun dokun? I mean, just look at the lyrics?”

    I can.

    Ranka to Vajra: “I want to tell this. This is my message. From me, to you….The sound of your heart DOKUN DOKUN DOKUN It’s the sound of LIFE, the sound of KINDNESS, So it’s the sound of PAIN the sound I can hear *instrumental as all the Vajra shut up and listen to Ranka* I don’t care what WE wish for! I don’t have to dress up in a coat of SUSPICION anymore! I don’t mind being burdened from time to time! I shall never leave you behind againnnn”

    AHAHAHAH XD

    @sherry
    “But if Alto was ‘mobbed’ by the conclusion, is there still something else, something really no one thought of that will come out?”

    I know one. Alto choosing Ranka over Sheryl but declaring that he’s going to kill Ranka and will stay with Sheryl. I’ve never thought of that. 😀

    diva
    Reply

  211. If only the inside of our intestines look as pretty as Ranka’s *g* Grace and Galaxy are weirdos. I still don’t get their goal. Ranka will prolly fix the conflict between Frontier and Vajra and live in Vajra star happily. Go Ranka go Ai-kun go Alto go! Brera I love youuuuuU!!

    Ef202
    Reply

  212. ani_d seriously stfu. You are the sole reason the AxS shippers looks bad. I’d vomit if you told me you had a relationship irl, because your way of thinking is revolting and so delusional it’s creepy. You seriously think Ranka has it harder than Sheryl? Because Alto said he will shoot that hack? It’s about time a character told Ranka she was “wrong”. Because up until this point NO character has ever told Ranka she was wrong, when she made selfish discussions.

    Also watch the subs, Alto NEVER said “I love Ranka” at all. So seriously go /wrist already you make me sick!

    Kaori
    Reply

  213. Did you know that not only Sheryl and Ranka has their own character arcs, but… Alto has one too, and quite possibly one of the strongest? Good luck figuring him out just as Michael and Yasaburo had done early on, for the people who misunderstand him the most are none other than the shippers themselves, who likes to mold Alto to a generic harem lead with superficial dreams, for some odd reason I can’t comprehend. Many people seem to think Alto is an idiot as much as the series is, but you’ll see why this is utterly far from the case in the next two episodes.

    cheese
    Reply

  214. @kagami
    “I do want Ranka to be happy, but let’s take a little look to the anime first : “What is Ranka’s happiness?” This one needs to be cleared up first. ani_d, druid, diva, and yuKime, as Ranka’s fans, what do you think of it firstly?”

    My reply to this is simple. People don’t have only one means of happiness. Many things can become the source of happiness for ONE person. Ranka’s happiness isn’t just about herself nor is it only about seeing others happy. If Ranka sees everyone happy, she WILL BE happy. If Ranka gets Alto, she WILL BE happy. So if only one of these happens, Ranka will be happy. If BOTH happens, Ranka will STILL be happy. Hopefully, she gets both to make up for that painful goodbye she had with Alto.

    For me, the love triangle is pretty much resolved already. Sheryl has backed down already, accepting Alto’s choice, seeing her choice of words and the symbolism of her fallen paper plane. Only thing needed is the confession from both Alto and Ranka and of course, the let’s-be-at-peace-with-alien-lifeforms resolution AND the part where Anata no Oto gets played. I wouldn’t prefer Anata no Oto to be used for Vajra-calming, seeing as Aimo pretty much has more meaning for the Vajra, instead of another song. Anata no Oto pretty much fits for Alto and Ranka’s reunion rather than vajra-calming. But some lyrics do seem to fit for Vajra, when I read diva’s post. XD But I hope it’s used for AxR ending.

    yuKime
    Reply

  215. Hooo boy…

    You people really need to calm down. It’s one thing to be emotionally involved with your side of the shipping, but telling someone to go “/wrist” (I can only assume it means ‘THAT’) because you don’t like their opinion, is going way too far. Seriously, it’s getting downright disturbing. Go cool your heads off.

    VF-25 Messiah
    Reply

  216. @cheese
    I also started having ridiculously high expectations for Alto after seeing him so serious and determined in the preview ^^
    Let’s hope we won’t be disappointed (I don’t think we will, since he either starts showing his true self, behind his acting mask NOW or never, this is the end of the anime already already…)

    Sherry
    Reply

  217. @sherry
    (Alto’s preview shot is stunning!)

    I have a problem with him. If he loves Ranka so much to the point that he’d rather see her die than be a tool of destruction, then why can’t he just keep her away from the Vajra?? Make up a plan to retrieve her, whisper sweet nothings to her ear and bribe her so that she’ll see things his way, and then exterminate every living Vajra alive. That way he gets to keep her to himself and she can feed Alto’s ego more by fawning on him. X) Ok that’s crazy. But I think I just melted at the fact that Alto would kill Ranka than have her become a tool. He loves her that much. I wish I have a hot guy like that wanting to kill me because he loves me XP hee

    Kendra
    Reply

  219. Sherry: Alto is consistent. Fans would snark and bite at him for being so indecisive and generic, but you’ll find that even though Alto’s character arc may be more diverse and widespread than the girls, it is actually one of the strongest. It goes so much more than “Alto’s dream is to fly”. It is so much more than “Oh Alto loves Ranka but he’ll kill her” and “Oh Alto stayed with Sheryl out of pity” because that is just barely grazing the surface and leaving the waves of depth underneath untouched. It’ll be awesome if some people would stop simplifying all of Alto’s actions down to *shipping* because that is grossly misunderstanding his character arc, as understandable as it can be to see people jumping on the Harem Lead bandwagon. Alto is more aware of things than we think. All the little clues that traced as far back as Episode 4, why Michael and Yasaburo are the only ones to see through Alto, Episode 23 has pretty much solved them. Again, it’s so ironic that the people who misunderstand him the most comes from the shipping fandom.

    cheese
    Reply

  220. @cheese

    I would lie if I said I didn’t care about who will end up together in the end, seeing how it became such a big deal -__-, but on the other side, all along, I’ve always been waiting for ‘something’ on Alto’s side.
    As I’ve already said before, Yasaburo’s words impacted me a lot and, looking back at all his actions till now, it was really like he said : Alto acted out at the perfection the roles each person wanted him to, in each situation; that was his very own way of running away from too many things piling on him nonstop and washing his hands off any responsibility, turning a blind eye on what was surrounding him.
    It’s incredible how this one sentence from Yasaburo described so well Alto’s character.
    But he finally stopped hiding in acting.
    And I am very excited thinking that after so long, Alto’s real face will finally be revealed to us, in all its glory which, as you said, in certainly not all about fawning over any of the 2 girls.
    I strongly think Alto’s beliefs and convictions are far above pity love intercourse, as noble as a samurai: he won’t go back on his words and will definitely fight to the end.

    Sherry
    Reply

  221. @yuKime

    Oh, yes I do know that, if Ranka gets Alto, she will be happy of course. Maybe I really should say this one more time : I want BOTH girls to be happy. What I want you to consider before answering the question is to think that not everyone is able to get everything they want, but they are still happy. Happiness is not only limited to one thing, but by any means, they don’t have to have all of that to be happy, and maybe, they can be fulfilled with their one and only “TRUE” wish becomes true. If Ranka gets Alto, she is happy of course, but then Sheryl would be left with… What? We even see her true happiness only lies in one thing now : someone who she loves.

    But then again, it’s still too early to speculate how will Kawamori end this, will he hammer Sheryl to death with nothing (and even if she lives, her story would be the most tragic as she don’t get her happiness in the series) or will he give the equilibrium end, where one gets their each own ultimate wishes fulfilled? It is very hard to see the end before episode 24 comes out now… I even still count Altoxno one for now…

    “For me, the love triangle is pretty much resolved already. Sheryl has backed down already, accepting Alto’s choice, seeing her choice of words and the symbolism of her fallen paper plane.”

    Hmmm… Ranka has already let go of her love in Episode 21 too (loved), so if we take everything into account, both girls have already given up on Alto if you ask me. Alto’s choice? Triangle will end when Alto give concrete evidence rather than just saying “protect”, you know? And take into account, WHEN did he join SMS. Alto’s choice to kill Ranka speaks rather loud that his love is no larger than his duty NOW. No, I don’t buy kill=love logic from Kawamori. I don’t buy that he loves him that he will kill her logic.

    But in any case, if you were hoping from straight confession, do you forget that this is MACROSS? Those who have seen original, surely would know that anything in Macross’ Drama (Hence referred as DRAMACROSS) is not going to have thing set straight without any twisting until the end ^^; We still have two episodes, and my Kawamori’s instinct still tells me that there is going to be MORE AND MORE TWIST ’till the end… It is, after all, Shoji Kawamori that we are talking about. Who says he is not going to milk the triangle shippers until they are dry of emotion ^^; Basically, Kawamori is an evil GENIUS, and my experience says not to trust him ’till the end if you don’t want to be disappointed. Never expect things will go into your way…

    Oh and please, what better thing to create surprise drama when the symbiolism CONTRADICT the future happening. I have watched too much drama that I know these things sometimes does not going as what it should be and end up surprising our subconsciousness lol.

    Hope everyone is ready for emotional torture for the two next episodes from our legendary troll, Shoji Kawamori 😛

    @VF-25 Messiah
    Wow, you were watching from the sidelines! How was the pairing wars? And my prediction about this becomes quite true, righto? (With a little bit of push of course… heh 😛 )

    @cheese
    That’s what happen when people get too deep into shipping and just see Alto’s unresponsiveness to the triangle as his character is dense and insensitive. If everyone only connect triangle as their judgement for his character, surely they would have only have “dense”, “wishy-washy” and something along those lines. This does not only include shippers, but ALL who have been judging Alto from the triangle, of course. (But then again, I still don’t want to say anything about him being impulsive for now. Yasaburo’s words disturb me too much…)

    Btw, love your take on Alto ^^

    Kagami
    Reply

  222. Kagami: “If everyone only connect triangle as their judgement for his character, surely they would have only have “dense”, “wishy-washy” and something along those lines.”

    Chances are, if some can’t (or won’t) read what Sheryl’s character arc is about, no matter how much focus it’s been given now, I wish them good luck figuring out what Alto’s is about, for there is an extremely good reason why Ranka is the pivotal point of his character story (she has to be for it to work, there’s no other way), why he didn’t look surprised at Ranka’s resigned confession, and why he didn’t chase after her. Trust me. The clues can be found from Episode 4 onwards and finishes at Episode 23. (Cryptic enough, cheese? XD) Alto is not as dense or idiotic as people make him out to be (especially for shipping needs.)

    cheese
    Reply

  223. @cheese ( Oh, I know you are Crisis from AS. Luv all your posts including those in CG (Hehe… Mr Dann gloatings come to an end now…) and others 😀 )

    Hmm… I do have some ideas of what you are talking about, but for some reason I can’t pinpoint at what it truly is. As far as I can take, he only appears to be dense in other characters judgement (Mikhail’s words rang in my heads), but this episode reeks of full misunderstanding about his character… Specifically from Yasaburo…

    Chances are, if some can’t (or won’t) read what Sheryl’s character arc is about, no matter how much focus it’s been given now, I wish them good luck figuring out what Alto’s is about, for there is an extremely good reason why Ranka is the pivotal point of his character story (she has to be for it to work, there’s no other way), why he didn’t look surprised at Ranka’s resigned confession, and why he didn’t chase after her.

    I request tl;dr. 😀 Alto’s character are in dire need to be freed from misunderstanding now that the series is gonna end ^^; And I’m sure as hell I’m not the right person to do that. AS members, please do the task (Specifically asking from MaiHikari, Swampstorm, stray, you cheese (hey, you are the motivator! 8) ) and any other who want to do some takes on his character). Anyone is very welcome though to give some insight on his character.

    Alto is not as dense or idiotic as people make him out to be (especially for shipping needs.)

    But unfortunately, we decide too fast on his character’s surface, without thinking for the 2nd time when something new about his character was given. I think it’s mostly because Sheryl and Ranka are more interesting character in most of our eyes. Look at it, Ranka got a lot of explaining for her character and Sheryl got a lot more explanation from their respective fans. But Alto? Complain, complain, complain… Only some or a little justified analysis about him^^;

    Kagami
    Reply

  226. Kagami : “Oh, I know you are Crisis from AS. Luv all your posts including those in CG (Hehe… Mr Dann gloatings come to an end now…) and others 😀 )”

    I suppose I shouldn’t be surprised, with the way everyone is flaunting my name around. XD
    Which name are u under?

    “Hmm… I do have some ideas of what you are talking about, but for some reason I can’t pinpoint at what it truly is.”

    And with good reason too, considering how the series have left you on your own too much to follow the thin trail of clues leading up to his story. As a shipmate puts it, they’re being bastards, that’s all. 😀

    I request tl;dr

    Well, hopefully it’ll be soon. *pokes a certain someone* 😉

    cheese
    Reply

  227. I’ve been poked and prodded to provide tl;dr, so let’s discuss Alto, shall we? Sorry if these thoughts are a little disjointed–I welcome discussion and additions!

    Also has been very carefully set up through the entire show, in a way that perhaps makes him a difficult-to-understand lead, but an excellent protagonist in a love triangle. For a long time, I couldn’t understand what Alto’s character arc was. He seemed so defined by the triangle that it was almost second nature to view his character through that lense.

    But as I was wondering one day, a few days before the airing up ep 23, exactly what Alto would do when he was torn between staying or saving Ranka, it fell on me like a load of bricks. He would choose his home, the Frontier. One of the main facets of his arc is his hatred of his home, feeling like it restricts his freedom. He had to learn to value it–to want to protect it.

    Swampy went further and pointed out that Alto’s character arc is also strongly tied between two extremes. His father and the life of an actor, which he wants to escape, and his job as a pilot in SMS. His job in SMS is directly a result of his interaction with Ranka. Ranka provided Alto with the perfect outlet for his frustrations.

    Take the Miss Macross pagent for example. It is the scene with his father that ends up sending him racing away to sorty. Flight is symbolic of Alto running away from home. Ranka? His excuse/reason for doing so.

    The key word in the Ranka+Alto relationship is “protect”. Go back and watch a few of the Ranka+Alto interactions in earlier episodes. Here’s a good one, the scene where Ranka is tying up Alto’s hair. Not only does he associate gentle hands in his hair with warm memories, but the thing that gets him to react to Ranka in that scene is her thanking him for protecting her. In short, Alto gravitates towards Ranka because being with her makes him feel good, like he’s acomplishing something, like she needs him. Nowhere is this more evident when they are alone together in the jungle of Galia 4, away from everyone else and anyone they could fall back on.

    I think Alto “wants” to choose Ranka at this point in time, to cement his role as “pilot” and “protector”. Notice I used the word “role”? That’s exactly what it is. Both Michel and Yasaburo keep hitting Alto over the head with “you’re not like me [aka, a pilot]” and “you are an actor!” respectively. And they’re both right, because Alto is using the idea of running away as “freedom”.

    Sheryl also plays a part as “Sheryl Nome”, and look at how enraged Alto gets at the hint in episode nineteen that she might be “lying to herself” because of it. It was the same back when she joined his piloting class for reasons he found less than pure–and Michel calls him on that too.

    That’s why his decision in episode 23 is about so much more than Ranka. It’s about admitting to himself that he used her as an excuse to run away from his past, from his home. It’s about him learning to see the true value of the place he lives in and the people who struggle to live there. That’s what it means to be a grown up–no longer doing the things that might make you “feel good”, and instead doing things that will make other people feel good. So, like the scene where Ranka realizes there are more important things than her love for Alto, so does Alto realize that he has things he wants to protect more than Ranka.

    How Alto felt about Ranka is one piece to his puzzle. I imagine the other piece–what Sheryl meant to him over the course of the series, will be unlocked next episode–and we’ll see all his interactions with her in a new light. Than, the last episode will be Alto’s final choice.

    musouka
    Reply

  228. @Kaori
    Well nobody told Ranka she was wrong because at the end she was never wrong, the only moment she really needed something standing against her mindset was back then when she went emo and wasn’t going to sing in the middle of the attack, and Sheryl pretty much stood against it and straight her up. After that, and all the death and destruction, Ranka choose her own path, to try to find a way to understand her past and make with peace with the Vajra, one can’t call that selfish when she did it on her own, as much with a pilot that would go willingly with her, she was going to ask Alto but Brera answered the Call and even though Ranka wanted to go with Alto she didn’t want to force it to him if he didn’t want to. At the end Ranka put her life into the line with her own path, he didn’t try to enforce it to all the people in Frontier, something that may had being a real selfish act.

    Nobody can’t call Ranka selfish at this point, lacking of confidence? not being some “Awesome” character? yeah, but selfish? No.

    I think you’re really following the stupid haters and the people new to macross mindset, that don’t realize that, “Leon’s way” isn’t the “Good Way” of Macross. Alto “killing” Ranka isn’t about her being wrong, but him not wanting her to be used to harm others and those others to be harmed. Yet, is really true what Leon said?

    Let’s think about it, Leon’s data about the Vajra comes from Grace, who obviously wouldn’t explain her real plans to him, because, how would the Vajra actually develop a plan to destroy a rival race as complex as creating a simbiotic being like Ranka? This is obviously a Man Made thing, Ranka is a product of Ranshei’s and Grace’s plans (which each one had one of her own). The Vajra, as it was explained, are hiveminded, and act more like a developed group of animals than somekind of human like intelligent race, they are like Ants, Bees, etc. You can’t expect them to go “Just as Planned” and use highly complex conspiracies. Humans on the other hand, yep, we do that a lot.

    The only real danger the Vajra represent, is the direct one, the same one an animal that see us as a threat would be.

    At the end, what SMS and Frontier would need to do is to deal with the real enemies, Grace and Leon, the Vajra, are just tools for them, and it’s more useful to take care of the one using the tools, that just destroying the tools and forget about the one using them.

    Grace is planning something big using the Vajra Network, maybe become some type of Galactic Big Brother like figure or do some “Imma becoming yur new God” shit. Leon is manipulating all the conflict and his data from Grace to keep his power, and probably become some overglorified dictator for Frontier. He really doesn’t seem to care any little about the people as long as he achieves what he wants.

    Yet, without the Vajra being hostile, both plans would crumble = GOOD END, with the destruction of the Vajra, Grace may lose, but Leon wins….and let’s face it, that’s a BAD END.

    Za Third
    Reply

  231. @cheese

    No, not yet, haven’t joined AS yet 😛 Still need to sort something out in my work^^ If a comment in your visitor’s message indicate yaoi or such… You’ll know 8)

    So, cheese, H.M.S Skull Fairy is preparing a counter-attack once next episode airs? I can see the battle between shippers rage just like the mech pronz in the next episode… Where did I put my uncooked popcorn, now?

    @musouka

    cheese huh? Can see her “insistence” will make everyone gave up and do what she wants 😛
    Fangirls, by far, is more annoying (But still lovable) than fanboys 8). No offense to fangirls of course, since I know that I am a hardcore fangirl in the closet^^

    By far, it is the hardest to grasp understanding of Alto, but what you have pointed out actually gave me almost the same idea that I was trying to figure out! But why is he taking the “protector” role? I really don’t think because he only “feels good” about it… Taking Alto’s childhood experience, especially his mother, I think it is safe to say that it impacts him quite a lot, affecting his emotion and wanting to protect someone he thought in need of protection i.e. Ranka, since he somehow sees her in the weaker sense… I should say that this, too, apply to Sheryl at some degree after knowing her sickness.

    Sorry for the messed up post, I’m in quite a hurry now…

    Kagami
    Reply

  232. Alto has immersed himself so much into the role that he willed himself to believe in the reality he constructed himself, he didn’t want to face the fact that he’s running away, period. Ranka presented the opportunity, especially in Galia 4, where she plays the role of the Rescued Damsel, so perfectly that Alto has fulfilled his role of the protector a bit too well, and this can be seen, indeed, in Galia 4. As long as he can play the part of protecting Ranka, then his eyes would never look back to his Kabuki roots which he ran away from.

    Episode 23 solved the puzzle, in that Alto was able to acknowledge what he did, and as a result, chose Frontier in the end. Too many times, Yasaburo and Michael’s comments unsettled and shook Alto, because they hit just a little too close to home with their wake-up calls and threatened to tear his mask off. Alto has played his role so efficiently there are times when he essentially became the character he was playing. This man is an actor, it is in his blood. But now, he has stopped running away and decided to stay. It’s time the fandom give him the credit he deserved.

    cheese
    Reply

  233. Ah, I missed this.

    Kagami: “No, not yet, haven’t joined AS yet 😛 Still need to sort something out in my work^^ If a comment in your visitor’s message indicate yaoi or such… You’ll know 8)”

    Wonderful, I can’t wait! 😉

    “So, cheese, H.M.S Skull Fairy is preparing a counter-attack once next episode airs? I can see the battle between shippers rage just like the mech pronz in the next episode… Where did I put my uncooked popcorn, now?””

    Oh, who knows… *whistles* 😉

    cheese
    Reply

  234. This is my most favorite episode yet! He finally chose Ranka. I’m afraid Alto might choose to die with her later on. I want noone to die anymore. shery it looks like she will break up with Alto. >.< I hope. I want BreraxSheryl!

    christina surman
    Reply

  235. No way in hell will Alto kill Ranka Capulet. Princess Romeo will back down and cry. I’ll laugh my ass off if we get a gloomy ending. The Newtype official arts looks high school musical happy. Alto= Hikaru. Ranka= Minmei. Sheryl= Basara! lmfao Hot hot hot!

    Jan
    Reply

  236. @cheese & musouka

    I have to hand it to cheese and musouka for the interesting insights on Alto’s character. I’m no shipper, but I have to admit that I’ve been viewing Alto a bit too much from the context of the triangle.

    I’ll have to revisit some episodes, but I agree with the fact that he had been using situations and people as a crutch in order to run away from his past. He’s still not someone I’d call a favorite, and I generally am annoyed by his passive-aggressive stance, but in retrospect the subtle development of his character has become quite interesting.

    From my perspective I think the triangle is an allusion to his own struggle with himself, and because of all the focus on the two girls, you only realize late that a whole lot of Macross Frontier is about Alto’s struggle to find a resolution to the division inside him, and coming to a true understanding of who he is and what he has to do to truly move forward with his life.

    nezumibento
    Reply

  238. @cheese
    cheese, don’t be lazy! tl;dr (I will still read it of course 😉 ) needed! Or if you are saving up for the next episode… Fine, I won’t bug you now. And I know you are a sadist at heart! You will take your joy in crushing the enemy’s fleet if the next episode gave us the last insight needed for Alto’s character (Refer : musouka’s post) as it will increase H.M.S Skull Fairy ammos into near unlimited if what we are predicting (High chance it would happen in next episode, or the revelation might be delayed until last episode) is true^^

    @Nezumibento
    Yes, cheese and Musouka’s insight is quite plausible, especially if you have re-watched Episode 4 and pay attention to Alto’s special concern about Ranka’s well-being and try to observe his conversation… I would not say that Musouka’s and cheese (and aneeshadc one in AS) take is true yet, but they are the most plausible explanation if you connect all his behaviour during the series. Yasaburo’s conversation is just the last nail needed to confirm Alto’s character.

    If we are trying the romantical approach to Alto’s confession on the roof, it is quite hard, really. I even try my best to answer the question using that kind of approach… But really, just… No. I can’t see Alto would have that twisted personality so sudden :S And the logic is only plausible in the eyes of shippers for some genuine reason…

    “From my perspective I think the triangle is an allusion to his own struggle with himself, and because of all the focus on the two girls, you only realize late that a whole lot of Macross Frontier is about Alto’s struggle to find a resolution to the division inside him, and coming to a true understanding of who he is and what he has to do to truly move forward with his life.”

    After reading this, I can’t help but feel we have biased view about SDF-M Hikaru… Even if it’s only a little. Now that I remember it, don’t people judge him through the triangle too? :S Dear Kawamori Shouji, I admit : You are the best schemer and Troller in the world.

    @Westlo

    “Cheesie hime is harsh mistress indeed 🙁 ”

    But you still love her~ 😛

    Kagami
    Reply

  239. @ Kagami
    After reading this, I can’t help but feel we have biased view about SDF-M Hikaru… Even if it’s only a little. Now that I remember it, don’t people judge him through the triangle too? :S

    Well, the past few episodes sacrificed Hikaru’s character to the love triangle, which is really unfortunate. Before, the the triangle was a parallel to his growth as a person. It wasn’t so much him refusing to choose a girl as it was Minmay was a symbol of his youth, and Misa was a symbol of his maturity. I guess in that respect the last ten or so eps are his mid-life crisis. :p

    musouka
    Reply

  240. @Kagami

    Sheryl won’t be hammered to death by Kawamori. I still believe that she will live on, but her NOT getting Alto isn’t going to pull her character to one that is tragic. It’s the same if Ranka doesn’t win, she’ll just have to learn to be happy for the one she loves and move on with her songs. Sheryl isn’t a weak character that will crumble if she doesn’t get Alto. Throughout the series, she was one who was employed as a character that is strong AND learns how to cope with losses/struggles with flying colors (See ep. 20 for instance). So even if she doesn’t get Alto, she will definitely have her good ending too… but the Minmei ending though which means she becomes even stronger AND continues to reach people with her songs. She was a songstress (a top-notch too) to begin with, after all. Alto x no one is not happening imho.

    Ranka saying “I loved you.” doesn’t mean she let go COMPLETELY. Even if two people with that strong a bond (such as Alto and Ranka) do separate, feelings still linger. You won’t be able to forget all that feeling (especially Ranka who loved deeply) all in a day. Sheryl’s giving up though seems more of a resignation and acceptance, knowing how Alto feels for Ranka (or thinking she DOES know how Alto feels). The choice Alto did say about killing Ranka is one that speaks of his maturity. He is willing to sacrifice his love for her to ensure that Ranka won’t be used for evil (because he KNOWS Ranka didn’t want that either- that’s the reason Ranka refused to sing once, remember?) AND to protect everyone in Frontier. Kill-Love logic is not impossible to happen, especially since Alto says he’s not going to run away anymore and let circumstances take hold of him. Whether he would be able to pull it off or not though is a different question to be answered later. What we know for now is Alto held strong emotions for Ranka ever since episode 3, he just didn’t show it openly, but the intensity in his actions when Ranka’s in danger speaks enough.

    The only one who was twisted till the very end (concerning LT) was actually the original Macross. But I wouldn’t expect Kawamori to pull every trick he did in the original Macross to be seen in Macross Frontier, he’s got to paint some originality into Frontier too. Sure he can pay homage to Macross (orig) but taking every scene (or the scene pattern) and putting it in Macross F, that’s a bit too much. I still believe the LT favoring Ranka wouldn’t be changing that much anymore.

    But that symbolism can be a foreshadowing which will not be called a foreshadowing IF it will contradict it’s meaning. Sometimes, symbolism just have to be taken as it is. Maybe the one in 23 is supposed to be like that? If not, well, we’ll find out on Thursday.

    yuKime
    Reply

  242. Like Alto, Sheryl also knows how to fold paper airplane and it didn’t fly as good. 🙁 I feel bad something fierce for her. I wish they’ll do a second season and it’ll be about Sheryl this time. I’ll go crazy rooting for her especially if they introduce a new bishounen and this time will treat her right. I don’t want Alto for her since AltoxRanka is imminent now and all Alto ever saw was Ranka from the very start. Ranka is the same way too. It’s over. Not gonna lie to myself.

    But but I feel really bad for Sheryl and I like her so much. Second season => Sheryl’s season! Kawamori, ne??

    flowerpotonurhead
    Reply

  243. @ yukime
    Hello again^_^.

    You know the Kill=Love logic might sound noble & all but honestly, it would be kind of hypocritical & cowardly of alto to just assume that ranka wants to die. She said she didnt want to be a tool but she once also said that she was afraid of dying & that she wanted to be heard. Which words should have borne more weight for alto, if he truly loved her?

    Also I wanna know what you think abt Musuoka & cheesie’s posts, plz? It just makes a lot of sense to me & I was wondering hw you would see it since you’re from the opposing side & all that^_^

    aneeshadc
    Reply

  244. Hmm…with Sheryl’s tears. Klan’s “omae no ai”. Alto’s flashbacks. And Alto’s actions throughout the series. I can’t really see the confession on the roof as anything but a simple revelation of Alto’s feelings for Ranka, which is love.

    Between being a Pilot and his will to protect Ranka, which one is real? I certainly don’t think Alto’s will to protect Ranka was fake. At all. If anything, his desire to become a pilot might be the one in question here. Yes, he loves the sky—the freedom it represents. Yes, he’s a momma’s boy. Yes, he doesn’t want to be a kabuki princess. But like Yasaburo has said, “would he really become a pilot if there is an enemy or not?”

    During their convo, Klan and Alto were shown to have a common denominator. Klan being a pilot because of tradition, but in reality, she wanted to be in SMS all because of Michael—thus her flashbacks. Alto said that because of his love for the sky he wanted to be a pilot instead of an actor. However, when he met Ranka, he decided to join SMS to protect her forever. While Klan was in SMS for Michael. Alto was in SMS FOR Ranka.

    When Galia was destroyed, more than the sky, what were the things that flooded his thoughts? Memories of him and Ranka having the time of their life in that planet. I can’t really see how Ranka is only an excuse for Alto to run away from Kabuki. His feelings for her are real. You can question his desire to be the hero of Frontier. You can question his desire to be the best pilot there is. You can question his desire to go back to Kabuki. But one thing is for sure, his feelings for Ranka were shown/portrayed to be genuine.

    Alto admitted that he was running away which coincided with Ozma’s words to him last episode, Yasaburo, and Michael’s. He may be running away from a lot of things, from his own feelings for Ranka and from his past. But when Alto said that he would kill Ranka if she was just going to be used as a tool to destroy them, and Klan calling it as his love, and you have Sheryl saying “she knew it all along” that scenario pretty much tells you that Alto has revealed who’s the girl he really fancied. In a very surprising way so to speak.

    Lastly this,

    ” In short, Alto gravitates towards Ranka because being with her makes him feel good, like he’s acomplishing something, like she needs him.”

    I believe OD from AS presented this theory on Alto as well a long time ago, and I do agree with this. But it becomes a bit off tangent if we say that Alto’s just using Ranka as an excuse to run away. Just because it makes him feel better about himself doesn’t mean his feelings are just an illusion. I don’t think the story portrayed Alto that way. Just look at the way Alto reacted to Ranka after she met him in ep 1. From the get go, Alto always had an eye for Ranka.

    Anyway, I’m looking forward to another Alto/Brera clashing next episode. 🙂 Looks like Brera’s back in action again. This may be where Alto finds out Brera’s true identity. Hopefully, he realizes he’s being played by Leon into making him want to kill Ranka.

    ani_d
    Reply

  245. @aneeshadc
    Hey! ^-^

    No, Alto doesn’t assume that Ranka would want to die BUT he is thinking that Ranka would be better off dead that be remembered as someone who was used to hurt many people in Frontier. Alto doesn’t want Ranka to be used like that and if it means killing her, then he’d do it. Not happily that’s for sure, but it’s something he had decided as his OWN means of protecting her. The words Ranka said about wanting to be heard was at the beginning of the show, she had accomplished that already and even didn’t want that anymore, realizing that the one she wanted to sing for the most was Alto. Sure Ranka is afraid of dying (who isn’t?) but Alto will do what it takes to protect her, even end her life. Thus the emotional face Klan made after hearing Alto’s painful decision.

    Cheese’s take on Alto was interesting and I agree with it. I guess it wasn’t that noticeable at first because the two (Ranka and Sheryl) seemed to overpower his character. But the way he had admitted himself as running away from everything and both Ozma’s and Yasaburo’s words in 22 and 23 seemed to impact him a lot, making him stop. The reason why a lot of people misjudge Alto is because we never get a chance to look at his thoughts or hear his thoughts. It’s always just him thinking, “I…” and “I am…” His thoughts were kept mysterious from the audience until 23 to make us speculate AND to make the impact of him finally DECIDING on something ON HIS OWN stronger.

    Musouka’s point though, I disagree on him saying that Alto is using Ranka as a crutch or his reason for running away. I mean, seriously, why would Alto take Ranka as his crutch when Ranka is the one relying on Alto all the more? And Michael already accused Alto of running away even before he got close to Ranka. Alto is protecting Ranka because he WANTS to and his reason to protect her is definitely not because he wants to run away but genuine concern for her (at the very least). The true reason Alto wanted to protect Ranka is still unknown (but I’m thinking it involves love) BUT he definitely didn’t choose Ranka in 23 just to cement his role as a pilot/protector. Alto stated that he wasn’t going to run away anymore because he was going to go all out and do what he thinks IS right, not what someone thinks is right or not what someone expects him to do. He decided to choose to kill Ranka because that is his own way of protecting her IF she would threaten humankind. It’s not him admitting that he used Ranka but it’s him admitting that he cares for Ranka BUT is willing to sacrifice everything (his love, his happiness and Ranka’s life) to do something that will be beneficial for everyone’s sake.

    yuKime
    Reply

  246. My take on it even is that Ranka is the reason Alto has decided on that made him think he has a goal in life to achieve. A person to protect so he had to do things. Remember the first time Alto talked in the hospital to Ozma (ep 3) and he told him to tell him about the Vajra. Ozma feels that Alto is just getting caught up by the moment, an impulse decision that’s why he gave him 24 hours to think about it. Michel thought the same, thus confronting him at the elevator, saying with the way he was flying right now, he’d be a failure as a pilot fighter (will get killed or will kiss someone). Alto denies this but doesn’t find any answer though for wanting to fight. Then he hears Ranka’s song and his look changed into that of resolution. He defnitely found his reason in Ranka. Not a reason to run away but a reason and the meaning why he wished to fight. That is to protect her.

    Alto refuses to do anything that concerns acting as much as possible because he didn’t want to be reminded of his past as a Kabuki actor. Thinking that as long as he did his job as a pilot and followed orders, he would be all right. But then, in ep 21, Alto is put in a situation where was torn between protecting Ranka and his duty as a pilot. He began running away again and chose to do what was asked of him, pretending not to notice Ranka’s pain. In episode 22, he realizes how correct Ozma’s words were when he told Alto that he was just acting based on what the circumstances thrown at him, being swept by emotion. In ep 23, he realizes that he should stop running away and finally decide what he would do, not just wait on circumstances or wait for someone to decide for him. Hearing that there is a possibility that Ranka was going to be used as a tool of the vajra, Alto knew he had to protect her and everyone else. He wouldn’t let emotions tie him down nor anything else. His decision in here shows he has grown and was willing to sacrifice everything just to do what he had to. Painful as it may be, he knows it is the right thing and Ranka would understand him.

    The line Klan asked, “Is that your love?” just perfectly words Alto’s decision. It was how he decided he would protect Ranka and at the same time protect the many lives of those in Frontier. Alto’s love is one that includes pain and sacrifice but nonetheless, it is still definitely love. A selfless love that wants to protect Ranka and everyone at the expense of hurt and pain of his own.

    yuKime
    Reply

  247. @yuKime
    “Musouka’s point though, I disagree on him saying that Alto is using Ranka as a crutch or his reason for running away. I mean, seriously, why would Alto take Ranka as his crutch when Ranka is the one relying on Alto all the more?”

    —
    I think Musouka’s view is not precisely that Alto consciously decided to use Ranka as a crutch – I think that it’s not intentional thing, but there are different kinds of dependencies not just being the one who obviously relies on someone.

    Being needed can also be a kind of crutch for a relationship, where your view of yourself is valid only because you believe the other person needs you to be that way. It may not have started out like that, and I think he genuinely feels something for Ranka, but it’s possible that Alto unconsciously clung to the role painted by the scenario where he is Ranka’s protector as a reason to run away from confronting his own issues properly.

    Focusing on that allowed him to ignore the need to resolve things, and gave him a substantial excuse to throw back at his family when they insist he come back, instead of him facing up to them properly and saying that ‘I may be good at it, but I just don’t want to act on stage anymore.’

    nezumibento
    Reply

  248. Alto can be genuinely concerned about Ranka, and still use her to run away from his own feelings of inadequacy. It’s not that all his interactions with Ranka were “wrong” or anything, just immature. Again, immaturity is not a bad thing in the world of Macross, it’s just a necessary step on your path to adulthood. Just like having Alto as a support changed Ranka’s life for the better, so did having Ranka to support change Alto for the better. I’m not sure he would have been capable of helping Sheryl the way he was early on the show, if not for his interactions with Ranka.

    The problem is, you can’t stay in that immature state forever. Ranka/Alto fans are misreading his decision and trying to make it about Ranka. Wouldn’t it be more likely that if “killing Ranka” was about protecting Ranka, he would have added something about making sure she wouldn’t do something she’d regret? Alto doesn’t want to kill Ranka, he loves her a lot. The point of that scene is that there is something he holds higher than Ranka at this point. Part of his decision is for her, yes, but you can’t look at the whole thing through shipper googles; they’re blinding you to the truth just as much as a Sheryl fan might have been blinded by the last ep.

    musouka
    Reply

  249. @musouka

    I don’t think Alto’s interactions (even if you say some) are immature at all. Sure some of them were rash and reckless but it was definitely not immature. Ranka being in danger even brings out the best of Alto’s piloting skills. See the way he acted when he was rescuing Ranka in ep14, Luca and Ozma were both amazed at how he was fighting to get into that Vajra ship. The only thing I think Alto did that was immature was being so close-minded with the Vajra problem Ranka asked him to help her with in ep 21. But still, I don’t mind Alto doing what he did in ep21 because his mentality was set-up by the circumstances that happened previously (such as Michel’s death). Him protecting Ranka (like in episode 13 and 14) was not because he was running away nor was it because he was compelled to as a pilot but rather because he WANTED to save her. Alto isn’t using Ranka as an excuse, but he sees her as his reason, a meaning to what he is doing, which is to protect her. See how when he lost Ranka, he seemed to have been running away again, avoiding decisions and just letting each situation take control of his emotions. In 23, he became resolute that he would face everything, sacrifice everything to protect what is the most important, which is Frontier. Indeed, Alto showing that he values Frontier more than Ranka means that he does prioritize Frontier but it doesn’t mean he’s forgotten Ranka, rather it was his way to save her (if she did become used by Vajras).

    Alto choosing to kill Ranka doesn’t mean he had stopped loving her (or caring for her) but rather it IS his OWN way of protecting both Ranka and Frontier. (He did say that he will kill her IF and ONLY IF she will be a threat to Frontier) If there was any way to save Ranka without killing her, Alto would definitely take that route first before resorting to killing her. Yes, it is definitely not all about Ranka but Sheryl fans should also see that Klan (the one who is supporting Alto x Sheriru the most) even interpreted Alto’s words as that of his feelings, revealing who he truly loves. “Is that your love?” And no, it is definitely not referring to Alto’s love for Frontier, I’m betting my paycheck on that. It’s not me looking through shipping goggles, but it’s me saying that the way Alto stated his speech to Klan, it meant he held Ranka as one of his most important friends (if not THE most important beloved) and cared for her so much, even if he denied it to himself (hence running away and pretending not to notice) BUT now that the whole world’s future depends on Ranka’s existence, he will be willing to give up what he holds dear (Ranka) to do a mature decision of sacrificing one life (one which he WANTED to protect) to do what is RIGHT. That makes his decision painful yet one which is correct, one that will do good for many. So it isn’t actually about Ranka but about Frontier, but it also can’t definitely NOT be NOT ABOUT Ranka. It concerns Ranka, no matter what angle you look at it.

    @nezumibento

    I still don’t see it anywhere that Alto used Ranka as an excuse to justify his actions of running away. He wanted to protect her, not because he was his excuse but because he was precious to him. Alto didn’t cling to his protector role (of Ranka) that much at all. If you even look at it closely, Alto even steps aside from his protector role when Brera came in (see ep 16 and 21). If he really valued Ranka because he was using her as his excuse of running away, I think he would have made it more thorough, thinking, “I HAVE to protect her. I HAVE TO.” But seeing as Brera was doing a better job at it, he decided to give it to him, feeling that Ranka would be better off with Brera as her protector. If Alto was using Ranka, he’d insist on protecting her, thinking he’d lose his reason if he didn’t do that anymore. But Alto wasn’t being selfish and actually thought what he think was best for Ranka, not what was best for himself, so I can’t see Alto using Ranka (consciously OR unconsciously) as his excuse.

    yuKime
    Reply

  252. @ yukime
    Thank you. I like that you’re atleast open enuf to try & look at the bigger picture, unlike most ranka fans, even if you wont concede on the alto/ranka ending.:D

    What Nezumibento & Musuoka said.
    I dont think musouka meant to say that alto didnt genuinely care for ranka because he clearly did, just that there were a lot of fundamental reasons besides the main one of wanting to protect ranka that spurred on alto’s decision to join SMS.

    I was thinking abt a few things last night; ya I’ve lost precious sleep over this stupid damn LT. I, for one am glad there’s only two more episodes to finish so that I can properly concentrate on my university courses thereafter. I’m sure I’ll miss all of the awesome characters, but I’ll cross that bridge when I get there.

    So,umm, ya, Chew on this a bit. When you’re watching the episodes again, you’ll notice that whenever the topic of why alto joined SMS is brought up in the series, it is always followed up by two things- 1)ranka or flashback of ranka 2) alto denying that he is running away or flashback of his dad. The only reason I can think of as to why they lump these three things together is because we are supposed to connect these three dots together.

    There is only one way to do that i.e alto used protecting ranka as a reason to join SMS because he didnt want to admit to himself that he was in fact running away. That pretty much connects the three dots. He finally admits that he was running away in ep 23 directly after he says he wanted to protect ranka forever. So, the only conclusion I can come to is that the actual reason alto joined SMS was because he was running away While Ranka became his much nobler psuedo reason, a cover for his inadequacy to deal with his past.

    Admitting that he was joining SMS beacause he was running away from his problems wasnt going to make him look good at all, not to mention all the flak he usually got from Michael for the same reason. So, he unconsciously latched on to Ranka as the reason, so that he can feel better abt himself. That’s where all the righteous anger comes from when he’s repeatedly being doubted by Michael Cause he also wants to believe in his role, more like he is becoming the role( his father’s acting advice). He isnt doing it intentionally, its in his blood, he is unconsciously slipping into his role so that he doesnt have to think abt his shortcomings or past in any way. While he does genuinely want to protect her as well, his intention, while good, werent all pure.

    Something else, alto’s kill=love logic does not make his actions noble or sacrificial unless ranka herself asks him to kill her, he has no right to decide something like that for her otherwise. How is he protecting her by killing her? Her not wnting to be a tool is not synonymous with her wanting to die. But if it was abt frontier, then it would make more sense because by destroying her, he is protecting the homeland that he has grown to deeply value.

    It’s still grossly wrong, but I’m sure he’ll change his mind abt it eventually. Atm he is driven by his fierce desire to protect Frontier & life on it. Its amazing that the boy who didnt want to live on frontier & hated it with a passion is now willing to go to any lenghts to protect life on it. What could have brought on this change?

    This is merely speculation but I believe Sheryl deservers the credit for this change in him. I think he’s been touched & infected by her contagious enthusiasm for life & strong willpower & determination against all odds. I think he learns to love frontier & decides to finally face his past because of her presence in his life. In ep 23, he talks abt hw fragile life is & hw people still want to continue to live despite the harsh reality. I cannot help but feel that this connects to Sheryl’s situation as well.

    Sheryl is dying & yet she wants to devote the rest of her life to singing for the people of Frontier. She is basically sacrificing her life, speeding her own death to protect the countless lives struggling to live on Frontier. While his desire to protect frontier is genuine, it is also a desire that is shared by Sheryl. I feel that he is doubly motivated in protecting frontier at any cost, not only because he has begun to value frontile & realize the fragility of life but also because he wants to protect what Sheryl is sacrifycing her own life to protect. Its his way of showing his support, trying to protect life in his own way, only from the other end of the spectrum from Sheryl as a pilot. Klan knowing abt alto & sheryl’s situation could have caught on to this & was maybe touched at this show of love for Frontier & sheryl. So from my POV, If ranka becomes a threat to all that he loves now, he will not hesitate to kill her. A case of what he wanted to protect above all else in the past VS what he wants to protect now above all else. A painfull resolution, indeed.

    aneeshadc
    Reply

  253. @Sherry

    There were three others?! I thought there were only three… (Kanaria, then Grace the Alto and other squad pilots) ^^; Maybe they changed it just like the way they did change some pics in ep 22?

    @aneeshadc

    Will get to your post later. Need to eat lunch first. Will be back with my (I’m already sure of it) long post. ^-^

    yuKime
    Reply

  254. I don’t know about you folks, but you can analyze Alto’s character till your head explodes and live on denial for two weeks, but Ranka’s still going to go dokun dokun dokun to a person who’s in love with her in episode 25. XD This is a love story, two people will get together, and look at the last episode’s title. YOUR sound? ahahah LT’s over. They’ll just tie the loose ends with sheryl and alto next episode, and reserve the finale with Alto confronting Ranka. DOKUN DOKUN DOKUNNNN XD

    The black atmosphere right now will turn into a lolpsyche!psyche!happyending!!!1 in episode 25. I’ll laugh hard at anyone who convince themselves we’ll get a dark gloomy ending lolollll

    diva
    Reply

  255. @yuKime

    I don’t mean that Alto used Ranka specifically as justification to evade his own issues – and I don’t disagree with you that his decision doesn’t mean that he stopped caring for her. It’s more that because of the relationship he has with her, she’s unwittingly provided a role for him to play that allows him to push his past and his issues away.

    He plays this role not just to Ranka, but to other people, Luca and Sheryl included. It doesn’t necessarily mean that he will insist on playing hero to Ranka, but it allows him to cling to the role of the ‘protector’ whose responsibility is to the people who he cares about. Him shifting his protection to other people reinforces this, but when questions of his past issues come up he dodges them with as much tenacity as he does shots fired in a dogfight.

    Again, as Musouka has pointed out, this isn’t the most mature way of dealing with your issues with your past, by blotting it out with new relationships and new tasks.

    However in the end when he can’t run any longer, he finally decides to grow up a bit and come through with a resolution that aligns his true feelings with the situation at hand.

    It was interesting to me that he chose the more painful route of reflection, through the path of no hope, where he has no choice but to destroy someone who means a great deal to him because he knows he can’t put her above everyone’s lives and dreams no matter how he may feel.

    I say this in part because from the point of view of a kid who’s never killed another person. This should weigh heavily in his heart because it’s one thing to kill Vajira, another to kill another human being, let alone someone who you’ve shared a relationship with. In more ways than one, 23 was really the end of innocence for him because of this.

    nezumibento
    Reply

  256. @aneeshadc

    Finally, a time to write a reply on you. Probably my last post here since I got to sleep early for early work tomorrow.

    “So,umm, ya, Chew on this a bit. When you’re watching the episodes again, you’ll notice that whenever the topic of why alto joined SMS is brought up in the series, it is always followed up by two things- 1)ranka or flashback of ranka 2) alto denying that he is running away or flashback of his dad. The only reason I can think of as to why they lump these three things together is because we are supposed to connect these three dots together.”

    Really? I thought he only had flashbacks of Ranka whenever he was confronted by him running away or by him being confronted by the reason he run away i.e. his dad. Remember in episode 4 when he returned to SMS, he had a flashback of his dad and Ranka, thinking, “Just you watch.” or something. If you don’t mind can you point out the instances where Alto did think of Ranka when he joined SMS? Actually, Alto saying up front that he did join to protect Ranka was still surprising to me since I really thought he was only convinced by her song and speech at the park, but it actually turned out that it WAS her. Or maybe it was both speech/song and her. Alto having flashbacks of Ranka always involved when he lost Ranka. Either she was kidnapped by Vajra or went to Vajra lala-land. I never seen Alto had flashbacks of Ranka when he was asked why he joined except for in 23 when he FINALLY revealed that he joined because he wanted to protect her.

    Again, I am still not convinced that Alto used Ranka as his excuse/logical cover for running away. If you watch episode 3 where he got resolute in joining SMS, it was one of determination and enlightenment, not one of running away and finding a good cover-up. Alto’s confession in 23 that he had been running away concerned many things but did not imply that he used Ranka at all. He had been running away from choices, not facing his father to tell him what he really wanted, not facing Ranka with his real feelings and pretending not to notice the two girls’ advances. But he now knows that it is time to face everything and thus he decides to choose to protect what is most important for everyone (while sacrificing what he wants to protect the most). The reason why Alto was shown telling Klan why he joined SMS is to make the scene more dramatic, more symbolic that Alto was willing to sacrifice big time, to protect Frontier. (Just read my post above since I think I’m just going in circles. ^^;)

    Kill=Love logic is painful and is SUPPOSED to be sacrificial since Alto is doing something he really DOESN’T want to do. Imagine, he wants to protect HER forever but he is doing the other with his own hands, ending her life to save the many. It’s sacrificial for Alto’s part, imagine the pain he’s inflicting on himself to do this. Sure he has no right to decide for her but if the Vajras were the one who decided for her, wouldn’t Ranka just prefer to die rather than cause death to many. We know that Ranka’s wish is for everyone to be happy, I’m thinking she will be willing to die if it would mean that it will save others. Protecting someone doesn’t always mean preserving her life. You can protect someone by protecting her wishes. Haven’t you seen dramas where one asks the other to kill him/her if he/she goes berserk. Um… this will be a bad example but I’m in a hurry so I grab whichever pops in my mind. Have you seen Van Helsing the movie? Van Helsing was on the verge of turning into a werewolf, a blood-thirsty animal out to kill innocent lives. Before that happens, what did Van Helsing do? He requested Anna (at least I think that’s her name) to kill him by shooting him with a silver bullet. That’s what Alto is going to do, kill Ranka instead of watching her kill people without a mind of her own. And I’m betting Ranka will not hold this against Alto BECAUSE she loves Alto and understands him. (Oh wait, we aren’t even sure if there will be a killing..) So yeah, in times, killing = protecting. In this case, Alto sacrifices what he had been wanting to protect all along to save a whole fleet. That’s a sacrifice that made me think, “Wow… Alto’s all grown up!” yet also made me think, “Jeez, couldn’t he at least think of some other way first…” ^^;

    “It’s still grossly wrong, but I’m sure he’ll change his mind abt it eventually. Atm he is driven by his fierce desire to protect Frontier & life on it. Its amazing that the boy who didnt want to live on frontier & hated it with a passion is now willing to go to any lenghts to protect life on it. What could have brought on this change?”

    The change is he stopped running away. I think Alto only says that he hates Frontier but in reality he treasures it very dearly. We know that Alto has a thing for dying people, he gets emotional when he sees someone dying in front of him, and that made him stop complaining about Frontier not having a real sky and realizing that even without a real sky, people struggle to live and survive in that colony fleet. So he wishes to protect it. Sheryl’s situation may possibly have something to do with it, seeing as he can just imagine what Sheryl is going through right now. The way Alto thought that Sheryl is becoming spoiled because she can’t help it, shows too that he is looking after her closely. Whether it’s love or friendship, I’d still say it’s the latter since I never see Alto talk so meaningfully about Sheryl to others yet.. I’m thinking they have a nice heartwarming talk tomorrow (based from the preview).

    And on the last paragraph we definitely disagree for obvious shipping reasons. I don’t think Alto knows about Sheryl not drinking her meds=speeding her death… does he? Anyway, if Alto really had fallen for Sheryl, he should have at least included her in his speech, I mean, it’s the 23rd episode already! Stop running around in circles and talk about who you really like Alto! RAWR! If it was supposed to be implied, the implication that he loved Ranka is much larger though. I mean, I’ve been visiting none biased blogs and they also see that Alto’s speech in the rooftop to Klan is generally a confession that he has feelings for Ranka all along. But yeah, it all depends on our interpretation. I guess, until Alto goes all out and shouts, “I love you Ranka!” some people just wouldn’t be convinced that he does love Ranka that’s why he’s going to kill her. I can’t blame them. I still didn’t believe SherylxAlto ending even after watching ep. 22 where almost all have been saying, they had kissed and sealed the LT as Sheryl’s victory.

    One thing’s for sure though, Alto doesn’t want to kill Ranka. At all. But if the big IF Alto has given will happen, let’s just see how resolute Alto is with his decision. Romance/Drama ftw!

    @nezumibento

    “He plays this role not just to Ranka, but to other people, Luca and Sheryl included. It doesn’t necessarily mean that he will insist on playing hero to Ranka, but it allows him to cling to the role of the ‘protector’ whose responsibility is to the people who he cares about. Him shifting his protection to other people reinforces this, but when questions of his past issues come up he dodges them with as much tenacity as he does shots fired in a dogfight.”

    Yes, he plays the role not just to Ranka and that’s the point. Alto has been protecting people (Ranka, Luca OR Sheryl) because he values all of them. Just that Ranka got emphasized in ep 23 because she was the reason he joined SMS. Him passing his protector role to Brera is him running away because he is unsure of whether he can REALLY protect Ranka better. It’s not him reinforcing he is using Ranka as an excuse at all.

    The way you interpreted Alto’s confession that he might have been running away is different from mine. I think Alto was saying he’s been running away from confrontations and choices, letting circumstances/his emotions take him wherever. He’s not using Ranka as a cover-up for running away. I really don’t believe that because Alto’s concern for her is real. Alto wanting to protect others is not him running away, the point is he has been wishy-washy about his decisions, not seeing it through all the way. See, when he decided to protect Ranka but then gave her away and let Brera do it. That’s running away. When he was asked to choose his own path in 22 and he wasn’t able to respond, that’s running away. When he blurted out he wanted to join in SMS, just because he wanted to know the Vajra, that in a way is running away (as told by Michel even). Him refusing to go home, even just to confront his father and give him a piece of his mind. That’s running away. Him pretending not to notice Ranka and Sheryl’s feelings, that’s running away. (Like one time, he knew Ranka was hurting and didn’t want to sing but he still asked her to sing, that’s running away.) But him choosing to protect someone all out, going head-to-head with all he’s got to save someone? No, I don’t think that is part of him running away. If anything, that is Alto being dedicated and determined to achieve something.

    But yes, I agree that him deciding to kill Ranka ends innocence and running away for him. Not letting emotions (especially his want to protect Ranka) tie him down, he will do what will be good for everyone, embracing pain and sorrow, to protect many instead of protecting a single life he had wanted to protect all along. Definitely painful but a sign of selflessness. What a true soldier would consider doing.

    yuKime
    Reply

  257. I just have to say how interesting it is that there tends to sober conversation rather than mud-slinging when discussing Alto’s character than when the two girls are the topic of discussion. LOL why is that?

    Anyway I appreciate all responses to my opinion. Discussion is always fun.

    I’m looking forward to tonight’s episode with all the upcoming battle scenes, and I hope they reveal more about what Grace and Ranshe had been working on this time.

    nezumibento
    Reply

  258. @nezumibento

    It depends on the people who are talking. =) I think Alto is being given some slack since he has finally shown some manning up moments. ^^;

    Hope the animation for the battle scenes will be glorious as always! After all, they just got 2 episodes, why not make it without thinking about the budget? XD

    yuKime
    Reply

  259. @ yukime
    Thnx for the effort. I should really go to sleep too, hav a class at 9 tom, but I’m too excited to go sleep!

    Sry, I made a mistake there, whenever the topic of why he joins SMS is brought up, its usually followed up by either only option 2) or both 1) & 2). What I mean is that these instances are usually followed up by an alto/ranka interaction or a flashback of her or a vehement denial from alto that he isnt running or a flashback of his dad. Either way though, I still find myself coming to the same conclusion. Please forgive me but I’m too lazy & sleepy to make the effort to point out all of the instances tonight,^_^ but if you really want me to, then I’ll try & do it for you at another time, kay?

    About the kill=love logic thingy, I did mention that I would completely agree with you if Ranka herself asked him to kill her & he agrees to do so. Then, it would be really tragic, sacrificial, noble & romantic of him to be willing to take such a step, but I dont agree with him presuming that its what ranka would have wanted. I’d feel better abt it if he had said, I will do eveything in my power to save her from the clutches of the Vajra, but if all else fails & she is to be used as a tool, against her will to hurt frontier, then he will personally kill her. I would have accepted this as love even if he didnt come right out & say it. Its just the way he worded things that makes me think that while he does love her & its painful for him to decide to kill her, he isnt in love with her.
    And, ya, he does play roles with all of his friends including sheryl & ranka but that doesnt mean his actions werent genuine just that he gets so immersed in his roles that when it concerns the girls, it is hard to decipher the extent of his feelings for both girls. How much of it was him getting caught up in the moment, swept by circumstances/danger & how much of it was real genuine emotion? This is the million dollar Question, which of the girls is the trigger to his real emotions? Ep 23, we learn what ranka meant to him & ep 24, I guess we’ll learn what Sheryl means to him & 25 is probably when he makes his choice. The interesting thing is his acting tendencies have kinda put both girls on the fence for now. I ( as I should being a proud sheryl fan) feel that Sheryl has the edge here & I bet you feel the contrary( just as a proud ranka fan should). May the better pairing & woman win!^_~

    aneeshadc
    Reply

  260. hey guys, let’s get away from the triangle for a while.

    does anybody actually noticed that the last episode aired on 9/11? quite shocked that they didn’t make any reference on it. Or is it because they should have aired the next episode last week(they stopped one week to make way for the Eurocup) and we will see the reference tonight.

    horace
    Reply

  261. @horace

    It’s japan so why would they? Or do you expect every show aired on television that day to make references to it? Does that even happen in the US? Them stopping one week for Eurocup is because said cup caused scheduling changes on the time table. I wouldn’t hold my breath waiting for a reference.

    VF-25 Messiah
    Reply

  262. This gets me annoyed.I root for AltoxSheryl,let’s have a little fate in the ending…to be honest if it ends with Ranka,I’ll classify this naime as the worst.I mean it would be like Alto chooses a dog over a real woman,let’s face it Ranka can’t even be considered a woman better a dog or a retard.I strongly believe that she is retarded,I mean come on she isn’t the only one who suffered in htis whole world but she acts like she is,look at Sheryl she suffered even more but she didn’t whine and she strongly loves Alto.For Ranka it just seems like the type of soap-opera right now,I mean I don’t think she even loves Alto she just needs one to change her diapers or better said to burden.
    It’s incredibly annoying to see that in a minute she is an ugly duckling(she is one of the ugliest characters from anime,I see her as a dog but dogs are cuter anyway),I do hope she dies,I seriously want her dead,she destroyed a magnificent anime.I mean what is wrong with animes or mangas at this moment,I thought we were somehow over with :ugly girl characters,stupid too,clumsy too,that cry and need pampering all the time.It’s depressing to see that though they are this way they get to be saviors of the world,they get the best guys and some even get to be stars as Ranka,okay I don’t deny her talent but come on you just don’t throw away one of your favourite artists because there is a new one in town.I mean even Britney and Christina shared sometimes the same fans,I mean I liked both of them as singers and I do like more Aguilera as a person and her voice is better,but anyway both of them had the looks.
    Ranka,I don’t know,seems with no class,there were some episodes with ads with her,that really are a pain for the eye,and she looks trashy somehow.I mean no matter what you say I have more reasons to like Sheryl:she had a worse story than Ranka,she had some humiliating situations,she must also accept the fact that the guy she loves is somehow dellusional,I mean he doesn’t have what it takes to be a man and that is:decision,she caries a disease and with all that she is strong,where does she get all that strength.What is not to appreciate about her,the fact that she is a true star and the fact that she supported Ranka indeed while the little “doggie” bit her,I mean when she had the opportunity to become a singer she didn’t say yes because of that,noo it was because she wanted to kiss Alto too,and the fact that she gets how the sister felt that made me think that she would be enough hypocrite to still her sister’s boyfriend,if she had one.I have so many ideas why I hate her that I hope I don’t get repetitive.But I ant to tell you that it simply is too much and this anime just became somehow too much,that I started to watch only screenshots and to read spoilers,Ranka is disgusting,I hate her,she even changed seets with Rukia,I mean way to go Rukia was the motif why I stopped watching Bleach,at least Rukia didn’t whine or cried.I do like Orihime but compared to Ranka she is notable famine and she isn’t an hypocrite either and she doesn’t whine so much.Anyway back to Ranka and the crew,the anime became lame.I mean you leave with a girl,she helped you in various occasions and you have another one that never helped you in anyway but just because you met her firstly does that mean you should end up with her.Now really did you noticed what typical idea they have,the guy remains with the girl he firstly met,though she wasn’t so much with him and didn’t care that much either about him till the second girl appeared,way to go,hypocrisy all the way.And yes she defies the laws of human beauty but that wouldn’t be a huge problem if she had other qualities than her voice,I mean she seems stupid too which is terrible if you aren’t beautiful either and she also needs babysitting,it gets even worse,right!It is depressing,I mean girls we should be aware maybe our guys get stolen by such types of girls as Ranka…lol…I hardly doubt it,seriously who wants to have a burden and not a girlfriend.And what it is amazing is that Alto and Sheryl were together all this time he still didn’t say he loves her,it’s shocking that he even thinks about Ranka to be honest,and he had much rare moments with Ranka,so it’s pretty illogical to choose her too.
    I don’t know this anime started so well,it should have better stayed on the mecha-action path than love triangle,it got ridiculous.

    Mira-chan
    Reply

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