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ef – a tale of memories – 09

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Summary:

With Chihiro still crying, Yuu hands her the diary to read so that she can regain some of what she’s lost. Speaking privately afterwards, he reminds Renji that he warned him not to get too involved with her. He thinks that Chihiro will return to how she was, but he also knows that this will happen again, and the more time passes, the more that the pain from the memories disappearing will grow. However, he’s not talking about Chihiro – he’s talking about Renji’s pain. That’s why Yuu warned Renji in the beginning, and he gives Renji the option of turning back and disappearing from Chihiro’s life while she still doesn’t know him. Renji gets angry at this and briefly pins Yuu against the door, but he then falls to his knees and cries. He ends up staying with Chihiro, and after reading the diary for a bit, she angrily throws it at him because she feels that things would be the same whether she reads it or not. She questions if she should continue on since every day is the same and thinks that she should end that self of hers. With blood now running down his face from being hit by the diary, Renji stays silent because he has no answer for her.

Kyousuke meanwhile gets called out by Kei, and after listening to her problems with Hiro, he reveals that his mother was an actress and that she really shined. He had seen that in Kei too, but she doesn’t have the same sparkle now that she had when he first saw her. That leads her to admitting that she feels far away from everyone who has found what they want to do, including her own sister. Across the city, Hiro finds Miyako sitting in a phone booth and learns that she’s using a phone card now instead of her cell phone. The two of them head to the beach together where Hiro apologizes for standing her up on Sunday, but she claims not to be angry with him because he’s here now. He then reminds her to go turn in her future aspirations sheet, and when she asks him what he wrote on his, he admits to having put down college for the time being. This leads them to talking about freedom, and Miyako feels that her own freedom is empty whereas Hiro’s is chosen for the sake of something he wants to do. He disagrees and thinks it’s more like the opposite of that, so she suggests he throw everything away, explaining that it’s his freedom to choose so it’s also his freedom to throw everything away.

Miyako then proposes that he run away with her, but Hiro rejects the idea because he knows that choosing makes one responsible. He nevertheless thanks her anyway for allowing him to feel that it’s okay to relax. Miyako responds by saying that she feels at ease with him too, and she surprises him by kissing him. He’s speechless afterwards, and since Miyako thinks he’d have something romantic to say since he writes shoujo manga, he eventually just kisses her back. The two end up sleeping together, and she asks him to look at only her because she doesn’t want to disappear from anyone’s heart ever again. Back at the church, Renji speaks with Yuu about what Chihiro said and admits to being scared of her, but Yuu thinks it’s natural. Yuu explains loneliness as something you know for the first time after happiness, and happiness is truly felt for the first time after unhappiness. The one piece of advice he gives Renji is to seriously face the story that Chihiro has written and to think about why is she writing such a story.

Chihiro slowly returns to normal with the way she acts towards Renji and with how she wants to write her story. At one point, she even says that she’ll love him like she used to and is surprised when he’s embarrassed. She admits that it had been painful for her to read the parts of her diary where she was stopped and unable to do anything, but things brightened after she met him – she had felt happy just by reading it. Later, when talking about personality changing with memory, Chihiro suggests that her old self died when her memory of the past four years disappeared. In tears, Renji rejects this notion and affirms that she’ll always be the Chihiro that he knows. He tells her that what she thought was impossible, yet after they part ways, he runs to the beach and finds the sand castle still there. Renji frustratingly questions both why it remains and if Chihiro’s memory is more fragile than sand, and he insists to himself that Chihiro is the Chihiro he knows. Chihiro meanwhile returns to her room and faces her novel again.

As for Kei, she and Kyousuke arrive at Hiro’s apartment, but she screams and runs out as soon as she sees Miyako naked in bed with him. Kyousuke chases after her on his bike and rushes to her side after she trips and falls, but he’s shocked to see her crying uncontrollably.

 
 
 

I don’t know whether to feel sorry for Kei or to feel that she deserved this after what she did two episodes ago. Probably the latter, though at least now this clears her up for happiness (maybe) with Kyousuke. I admit though that I was a bit surprised to see Hiro in bed with Miyako so quickly. More than anything, it most likely reflects Miyako’s desire to do whatever it takes to keep Hiro from forgetting about her, and from the looks of it, it worked. At least now the ED sequence with Kei running makes perfect sense.

I was rather disappointed though, that for an episode with such a critical Hiro and Miyako part, they still spent more time on Chihiro and Renji. Instead of concentrating on those two so much, maybe they could have spent a bit more time developing Hiro and Miyako before throwing them in bed together like that. Conversely, the episode could have been devoted entirely to Chihiro and Renji, and more time could have been spent on Chihiro’s recovery. As it was, it seemed remarkably fast that she went from throwing a diary at him to being in love with him again. On second thought, that’s probably a bad idea since I still don’t particularly enjoy watching them compared to Hiro/Miyako/Kei/Kyousuke. I do wonder how that relationship is going to end though. It doesn’t seem like there’d be a truly happy ending unless Chihiro somehow magically regains the ability to keep her memory.

On a side note, I half expected Miyako to start singing dango dango dango dango dango daikazoku at this point. I assume it’s an intentional reference to Clannad since they’ve already included one to School Days.

December 1, 2007 at 5:42 pm
88 comments »
  • December 1, 2007 at 5:45 pmchupacabra

    First, looks awesome can’t wait for the subs

  • December 1, 2007 at 5:54 pmyahiko03

    Wow this is getting heated. I wonder what will happen next?

  • December 1, 2007 at 5:54 pmKresnik

    Can they got Kei story covered in 3 episodes? Or would they rather to complete Miyako story instead..?

  • December 1, 2007 at 6:03 pmGP

    Going right for the sex attack. That always works on nice guys.

  • December 1, 2007 at 6:03 pmpuyo03

    So good! SO FREAKIN’ GOOD! God, I’m loving this more and more.

  • December 1, 2007 at 6:05 pmGP

    Oh, and I figured it’d be more about Chihiro and Renji in this episode. I always expected that part of the story to get wrapped up first anyways.

  • December 1, 2007 at 6:06 pmgetsu

    Wow, Dango!

  • December 1, 2007 at 6:06 pmgolthin

    Well, Miyako made her moved and Kei is ***OUT***, Kyosuke is probably going to end with her.
    Like I said, Kei erasing those messages was the best favor she could do for Miyako.
    Another childhood friend get the axe. Only way Kei could end with Hiro is for a CANVAS2 ending. Damn it! Why do every single girl that I support get shafted! :(

  • December 1, 2007 at 6:08 pmgolthin

    Kei story? It is over! She just ends with Kyousuke!

  • December 1, 2007 at 6:09 pmMikeW

    With the way the series is progressing, I wouldn’t expect them to cover the other story. Rather, the writers might just set the stage for it by the end (leaving two scenarios for a potential Season 2?).

  • December 1, 2007 at 6:09 pmMakie

    I can´t wait till the anime episode comes out, I hope that a DVD will come out in some time.^^

  • December 1, 2007 at 6:16 pmAle

    So Miyako went and really made her move.

    Kei should’ve been honest with Hiro sooner, he may have noticed her, but no, she had to keep beating herself up and doing silly things because of Chihiro…

    I hope she can move on and go with Kyosuke at least, and that this doesn’t hit her too hard.

  • December 1, 2007 at 6:17 pmelba

    Somehow I couldn’t hold back an evil grin when Kei suddenly discovered Miyako in Hiro’s bed :D

  • December 1, 2007 at 6:19 pmlolilol

    where did Gundam 00 09 go ??? that post dissapeared from randomc.animeblogger.net -_-

  • December 1, 2007 at 6:21 pmMikeW

    you’re right it was gone for some time….. but not its back to normal

  • December 1, 2007 at 6:22 pmMayuna

    YES you did it, my cute Miyako!!! I was waiting for this to be animated after I read the manga xD Wiehh, I love Miyako so much~~ I wish her all the happiness she can get~. But still a little bit sad for Kei T^T I dun want to find a girl sleeping in the bed of the boy I love D;

  • December 1, 2007 at 6:25 pmAle

    That’s mean…

    I mean, I didn’t like Kei because she’d hurt Miyako with her actions and it was because she couldn’t be honest to Hiro. To me it was understandable, just that the harm caused wasn’t justifiable (although by now it means nothing), because Miyako had nothing to do with her childhood problems.

    But that doesn’t make Kei a bad person, just immature and with a self-esteem problem, not being able to get over her past. Miyako shares those traits, she just handles them differently because the situation is also different.

    I still wish for Kei’s happiness in the end and that she can recover from this, but probably she needed a harsh lesson to get over it. What sucks is that if she’d grown up sooner she wouldn’t have lost Hiro in the process.

  • December 1, 2007 at 6:29 pmJezreel

    no manches está cañon puro sexo, haber si no pasa nada como School days

  • December 1, 2007 at 6:30 pmTaelrak

    dango..dango…

    if they do have a s2, i’d rather they cover yuuko’s story :D

  • December 1, 2007 at 6:35 pmGP

    If this is the end of it, then I can’t see what the rest of the eps will take up. I somehow doubt it’s over just yet. But anyways, the way it was going the outcome was preset anyways. It was clear a few eps back. But with 4eps left, who knows what’s left.

  • December 1, 2007 at 6:36 pmGP

    Make that 3 episodes, not 4. I thought it was 13total but it’s 12. Oh well. Next one might be more about chihiro again.

  • December 1, 2007 at 6:38 pmMG

    Looks like Kei’s story is going to come to a fairly pathetic and predictable end with Kyousuke presumably consoling her and `taking’ her. How disappointing.

  • December 1, 2007 at 6:38 pmyahiko03

    Im so glad that Miyako finally made a move. You go girl! Let’s just hope everyone is happy in the end.

  • December 1, 2007 at 6:41 pmyahiko03

    The whole entire series was more focused on Chihiro and Renji. I hate that too. I pray that they don’t take up the rest of the episodes.

  • December 1, 2007 at 6:48 pmgolthin

    @GP
    Dude, we lost! The only way that Kei can end with Hiro is for a Canvas2 end and I know you are not familiar with it. With 3 more episodes left, it is time for Kyosuke to try to woo Kei.

    The twins have really been dealt a bad hand by Fate. It really broke my heart when I heard Kei was coming to wake Hiro up and My eyes just opened wide when I saw the door knob moving.

  • December 1, 2007 at 7:00 pmGP

    @golthin

    I was expecting this, the whole show is setup for you to like Miyako more and for her to win. The fact I posted so much about this show is that Kei was being looked at as some cold hearted bitch which isn’t the case. I don’t hate either, and I’d personally take Kei over Miyako cuz she’s tsundere and I’m a sucker for that sorta girl.

    Anyways, all the signs,hints and so forth where there. It was never really a love triangle when you think about it.

  • December 1, 2007 at 7:10 pmyahiko03

    Gp it’s not over yet. We got 3 episodes left, anything can happen.

  • December 1, 2007 at 7:32 pmelba

    By the way, did anyone notice the lyrics of the ED were slightly different from the ED used in episodes 4-6?

  • December 1, 2007 at 7:34 pmDarkReign

    http://randomc.net/image/ef%20-%20a%20tale%20of%20memories/ef%20-%20a%20tale%20of%20memories%20-%2009%20-%20Large%2026.jpg

    My first sight on this pic caused me to somewhere misundertand it and made laugh or something.

  • December 1, 2007 at 7:50 pmgolthin

    @yahiko03
    I really hope and wish you might be right, but I know realize this show is about the twins ending with tragic endings. Kei and chihiro are not supposed to be happy at the end of this show. Well Kei might find a little of happy with a second choice within kyosuke but that is about it.

    I hope you are right and I am wrong and what seems impossible happens. Hiro already promise Miyako to always be by her side and he doesn’t seem to be the type that will break such a promise. Only way i can see is that Miyako go crazy and possesive with him now that she caught him up and this separate them. He doesn’t really know her dark side yet thanks to stupid kei erasing all those messages.

  • December 1, 2007 at 7:56 pmChicle

  • December 1, 2007 at 7:59 pmMikeW

    “The whole entire series was more focused on Chihiro and Renji. I hate that too. I pray that they don’t take up the rest of the episodes.”

    If the prologue DVD is any indication, there’s still going to be more conflict between Miyako and Kei. But yeah, the outcome with regard to Hiro is effectively over.

  • December 1, 2007 at 8:03 pmsushi

    OMG Miyako finally made her move, an episode i’m really forward to now heheh…yes die kei die!!!! *evil grin*

  • December 1, 2007 at 8:07 pmdivine

    @Omni:
    “-I half expected Miyako to start singing dango dango dango dango dango daikazoku at this point.”

    OMG again! Exactly what I was thinking when I saw her telephone card.

  • December 1, 2007 at 8:08 pmyahiko

    I don’t think that the twins will have a bad ending. I just hope that Chihiro will finally get her memory to cooperate like normal. And for Kei, she should be just fine. Broken hearts take time to heal.

  • December 1, 2007 at 8:13 pmdivine

    @elba:
    “By the way, did anyone notice the lyrics of the ED were slightly different from the ED used in episodes 4-6?”

    Good ear. For this episode they used the second verse of Kizamu Kisetsu (刻む季節), which is sung by Okada Junko–Kei’s seiyuu.

  • December 1, 2007 at 8:44 pmGP

    It is over, hell, it never started. Like I said, it wasn’t really a love triangle from the start. The signs are clear it was all set in Miyakos favor.

    She’s got a more sad past than Kei.

    She spends way more time close to Hiro through the whole show.

    Kei never says anything which is stupid when you think about it. If this was a true love triangle type show she would’ve said something when he was taking her back home after she got hurt.

    Miyako never does anything wrong, breaking it down, not one mistake. Yet we get Kei with a few (out of jealousy, but since she never says anything early on it’s too late anyways).

    Fact is Miyako is setup as the victom, and you know how that goes, they get the happy ending even if the world is coming to a end.

  • December 1, 2007 at 8:56 pmgolthin

    well, Kei did everything she could do WRONG. The first mistake was to declare open war to Miyako and to not confess to Hiro! Second mistake was to delete the messages, though she couldn’t have known how scary those messages were. Third mistake was forcing Miyako’s hand by making her think that her and Hiro had slept together. She forced Miyako to do the same.

    I feel very sad for her, because she was my favorite, but when you try to win a guy with just waking him up in the morning and making him lunch and you made your opponent think you are already in bed with him, this is what happens. Kei good try, but not good enough.

  • December 1, 2007 at 9:04 pmGP

    @golthin

    That’s what I mean, it’s all one sided really. The show doesn’t try to balance it out and have Hiro work it out overtime like a harem show. From the start Miyako has been “in the lead”, and you really have to wonder why Kei never says anything. She might say something NOW, but it’s already late from the looks of it.

    You can’t help it when the writers have it be set already. And I haven’t looked at how the visual novels go, but I think it’s like this in there anyways. It’s all Hiro x Miyako from the start.

  • December 1, 2007 at 9:09 pmDon’t Taze Me Bro

    I wanted Miyako to be with him anyway, she seemed much more naive/innocent to me.

    Besides, Kei would screwed up her sister, probably would’ve screwed up Miyako too (hey, she probably will later on).

  • December 1, 2007 at 9:23 pmZzz…

    The problem with Kei isn’t her inability to move on from her past or her self esteem issue or her unwillingness to be forthright. It is perfectly fine for her as a person to remain in her own sealed fantasy world. Growing up should be her choice to make.

    The problem with Kei is that she wishes to drag everyone else down into the darkness with her regardless of what they dream of and the path they seek. She wanted to prevent others from growing up and moving on. To deny them their right to choose.

    That is what is so wrong and unforgivable about her character.

  • December 1, 2007 at 10:31 pmAle

    Not really, she only does that because she hasn’t moved on. I’ve said it before; she thinks she has no right to confess to Hiro because of what happened to Chihiro years ago, so when someone comes around she’s all “oh no must erase” instead of being honest with Hiro. It’s the same mistake that led her to such a tragedy back then, and she still hasn’t realized.

    She’s not a bad person, just immature.

  • December 1, 2007 at 10:34 pmDon’t Taze Me Bro

    Last time I checked, being immature can lead to bad things. Therefore, she’s a bad person.

  • December 1, 2007 at 10:44 pmsvm

    Random Thought:

    I think one of the strongest images in favor of Miyako this whole time was the deal with color versus black and white. During Hiro’s monologue when Miyako first visits his room the animation turns black and white, matching what Hiro is thinking about, “The color that’s missing from my world…Searching for that, I…” and then Miyako suddenly appears into the picture again in full color.

  • December 1, 2007 at 10:50 pmrelentlessflame

    “I’ve said it before; she thinks she has no right to confess to Hiro because of what happened to Chihiro years ago, so when someone comes around she’s all “oh no must erase” instead of being honest with Hiro. It’s the same mistake that led her to such a tragedy back then, and she still hasn’t realized.”

    Indeed — which is why this episode’s events are important for her character. While this is incredibly painful for her at the moment, it’ll ultimately help her get over the guilt from the past and be able to move on in life. And she may even realize that there are other guys out there that she has more in common with, since as it stood she and Hiro seemed to be heading in opposite directions in life (i.e. not all that compatible). I think Kei might finally be able to find a path to happiness, as both Hiro and Chihiro would want.

  • December 1, 2007 at 11:32 pmgolthin

    you know, now that Miyako is the winner, we are not talking about how she is so desperate for Hiro, that she is not even going to confront him about Kei sleeping with him. I wonder if this might come to be something important in the future. About Miyako not wanting Hiro to meet with Kei anymore and Hiro not understand why, and she accusing him of cheating on her with kei. It will be interesting to see this.

  • December 1, 2007 at 11:45 pmtomatolover

    gawd i love this

  • December 2, 2007 at 6:01 amgolthin

    @Skyfall
    Well, I didn’t know the visual novel only had one path. I heard many people saying that there were more paths but i guess they were assuming. So basically the last 3 episodes will be like you say then. I know that Canvas2 had many hints, but Most people missed those hints or discarded them as just plot devices. I will about 99% of the people watching the show didn’t catch or discarded the hints the first time they watched the show including me.
    Only after I watched the show again i said to myself “Ahhh, it makes sense now”.

    Well, I wish I had been familiar with the Visual Novel, It would have saved me the time and aggrevation for supporting a loser.

  • December 2, 2007 at 7:09 amGP

    @golthin

    Don’t let it get to you man, in any harem show that’s got lots of girls, the one that wins isn’t the one everyone likes the most or something. As long as the writers work out a good reason as to why that girl wins then it’s fine. It’s not really down to popularity polls or anything. This isn’t bleach or Naruto etc =P

    Anyways, yeah, the Visual Novel (though I haven’t played it) doesn’t have multiple endings with different girls like other harem/eroge games/novels. It’s a pretty set deal. And like others have said, and me also, the hints that this was all set from Miyakos favor from the start are there. Had the visual novel been like others where you have multiple endings with different girls then we would’ve seen a more evened out time for each girl with Hiro. The fact that Miyako spends twice as much (if not longer) around Hiro is pretty much a dead giveaway imo. Then there’s the whole thing about making Miyako the Victum and Kei the bad guy in all of this. Even though Kei really isn’t a “bad” person. But hell, when the story is like this, debating it is kinda moot anyways.

    I always like the tsundere girls (you guys should all know what that means) so liking Kei more than Miyako is just something I do.

  • December 2, 2007 at 8:04 amgolthin

    Well, the only thing that I see is that Miyako is a very needy girl, and the relationship will not last. I also don’t see the relationship with Kyosuke and Kei lasting. the good thing is that about 95% of highschool sweet hearts don’t marry and those that marry have a high divorce rate. Miyako fear of disappering is very strong, and Hiro will probably leave her alone a lot due to the kind of job he will have. But why I am worry about the future of ficticious character, the show is all about now.

    @GP
    Kei was one of my hope for a childhood friend to take the trophy home.
    Now I only have Koko from DEcapo, Mao from Kimikiss, Reika from Goshuushou-sama Ninomiya-kun and I think another show I can’t remember the name right now.

  • December 2, 2007 at 8:52 amGP

    I don’t see why you think opposites don’t attract? Forgetitng about the show for now, if two people are exactly the same in everything that would lead to conflict. Having the same likes in a few things doesn’t mean two people are the same. A good long stable relationship needs to be balanced.

    i.e. if you’re lazy, your partner can’t be lazy also, cuz then you’ll fight over who’s lazy and who’s not doing what and so on.

    If you want something that works, you just need to like a few of the same things, type of music, movies, anime maybe? But that DOESN’T mean you’re the same. In most cases two people that are very close in both personality and so on will not get along after a while of being around each other.

  • December 2, 2007 at 9:31 amUnknown Voice

    OK now its official…. Miyako is a bitch and I want her to die….

    i am waiting for her slow and painful death even more than i did with king of retards makoto….

    I will be seriously disapointed with this show if they will end it with HiroXMiyako….

  • December 2, 2007 at 10:42 amFireChick

  • December 2, 2007 at 11:55 amyahiko

    Crazy. i know I mentioned Canvas 2 earlier, but not in a way to compare. Please don’t bring that up again. I said it before, I don’t like to see relatives getting together as lovers, that’s disgusting. To me anyway. Well it doesn’t matter what anybody say about Miyako. She is happy with Hiro and he can change her life around to be a more stable and beautiful woman in the future.

  • December 2, 2007 at 12:21 pmGP

    I think at this point, though I like both shows, I think Clannad is the better of the two. Newest clannad ep was sad, It brought tears to my eyes. heh

  • December 2, 2007 at 12:26 pmGP

    yahiko

    Just because they’re cousins doesn’t make it wrong or even disgusting. Lots of places in the world let first cousins marry, Japan being one. And if you’re 2nd cousins with someone you’re not even really related to the extent that it would showup in your blood at all. So I don’t see a problem with it really. Sociaty, specially in the US makes it seem wrong, but the reason behind it being illegal or seen as wrong is really due to the genetic defects you can get if say, a brother and sister had a kid.

    But even then, as I said, “cousins” as used in Japan and often in animes are of the type that are branched off so it’s not even a issue really. The only way you’d know they’re related is if you looked at the family tree/register. A DNA test wouldn’t show anything probably.

  • December 2, 2007 at 1:06 pmaloger

    nice epi

    [img]http://www.anemora.com/frezer36[/img]

  • December 2, 2007 at 1:58 pmDeadlyrain

    Lol, Hiro jumps from kissing to sex all in one day. I don’t think I can respect Japanese anime directors anymore to making all Japanese women seem a bit… slutty…

  • December 2, 2007 at 2:01 pmyahiko

    GP, I strongly disagre. Yes cousins do mess around,but in my own opinion I think it’s disgusting. There are billions of people out there to have as a lover. Relatives love each other not to be inlove. You know what I don’t even want to talk about this anymore, because it only makes me sick. It has nothing to do with this anime anyway. This will be the last time I talk about relatvies inlove. Excuse me for bringing it up. Now that EF is almost over, what else is good to watch?

  • December 2, 2007 at 3:14 pmTensai Otaku

    OMG!!
    OMG!!!
    OMFG!!!
    HE FUCKED HER SO HARD….BUT SOOOOOO HARD THAT SHE CAN´T STAND ANYMORE!!! :D

    NOW IS THE TIME TO THE IMORTAL CLICHE FROM THE SECOND CHARACTER TO GET THE CHANCE AND SCORE FOR ONCE AND FOR ALL …..FUCK HER BUDY….ER….I MEAN HELP HER….. T_T ;D

  • December 2, 2007 at 5:07 pmSomethingLeft

    @ Tensai Otaku

    Less caps please and stay off w/e you had before posting.

    Hmm..this is gunna get messy isn’t it. Sorta can’t imagine how Kei’s going to confront hiro now…=/

  • December 2, 2007 at 5:52 pmAle

    @yahiko

    Clannad, Shakugan no Shana season 2.

  • December 2, 2007 at 5:52 pmGP

    I get it, you don’t like the idea. But what I was trying to point out is that although technically they’re “relatives” It’s the type of relasion as that of someone who’s married into your family, like a brother-in-law. Yes you are related, but I mean come on, there is no solid blood relation between distant cousins. Yeah you probably have the same great grandfather but uhh, if anyone living in the same town/village etc trace their roots far back enough, i’m sure they’ll run into the same relative. It’s just a matter of how far back you go with it.

    But all the genetic stuff aside, what I was pointing out is that although they’re “cousins” they’re probably so distant off and of different branch families that they’re not related as close as what people in the west would consider a normal “cousin” as being.

  • December 2, 2007 at 7:57 pmgolthin

    @deadlyrain
    It is only Miyako that is sluty, she is desparate to hold on to Hiro that she confuses it for love. That is why it is not going to last. Hiro is also desparate for companion, remember what Kei told of how she rescued Hiro from his loneliness? Like people have said, Hiro and Miyako are have so many things in common, it is like marrying yourselve. I don’t think Hiro is going to be able to give Miyako what she needs once he becomes successful with his manga.

  • December 2, 2007 at 8:01 pmgolthin

    @GP
    Even though marrying 1st cousins is LEGAL, Society in Japan frown at it. They frown at relation between in laws, like a stepson and a stepmother. Why do you think so many hentai have those kind of relationships, because even though they are legal, they feel wrong because they are related. Strangely, in the west those relationships are not as forbidden, considering some states in the USA forbid 1st cousins marriages.

  • December 2, 2007 at 8:38 pmyahiko

    Thank you Ale for the anime. I will start watching them now.

  • December 2, 2007 at 8:56 pmfamily guy

    I do not think it right for 1st cousins to sex w/ each other and not fright for stepson and a stepmother to do anything at all w/ intimacy. In the USA forbid 1st cousins marriages, it is true, it is God’s country. Some guy running for President married second cousin, Gooliani and he haunted to today about this. So second cousin is legal but not for sex for taking care of children if poor & husband dies or something, like in the South of the USA.
    In the South there are people like Elvis Presley and he married 14 year old but did not relate to her until she 18. The sex part is the bad part!

  • December 2, 2007 at 9:16 pmGP

    @golthin

    Yeah, 1st cousins. But I mean, they never state if it’s 1st cousins or not. Just saying they’re cousins could be anything from 2nd to 3rd and even 4th (do they even go up to 4th?) I have quite a few 2nd cousins, and maybe even a few 3rd cousins that I don’t know about but are out there.

    The thing is that 2nd and 3rd although called “cousins” aren’t that closelly related to you as you’d think. Maybe I just have a open mind to it all, but it really doesn’t bother me if two 2nd or 3rd cousins get together. And first cousins happen often all over the world, I still don’t know how the whole main/head family and branch family stuff works. If you’ve got any details about how that’s figured out I’d like to know.

  • December 3, 2007 at 12:01 amAle

    As far as I know babies born out of first cousin couples have a higher chance of having congenital disorders.

  • December 3, 2007 at 1:32 ammeromero

  • December 3, 2007 at 6:01 amWacky

    I won’t really say much about the morale of being lovers and the stuff like that…

    Well, despite what quite a few others (here and elsewhere) complained about the episode being a little… ‘unclean’ well come on, open up, this was adapted from an 18+ visual novel, definitely not suitable for the all-too-young, and you’d expect that the studio would borrow some elements from it, H-scene or not. Even though KyoAni made ‘safe’ anime of
    stuff like Kanon, doesn’t mean that all studios have to make it entirely clean.

    Of course, there’s no need to get as hyped up as Tensai Otaku up there…hm…

  • December 3, 2007 at 10:13 amWacky

    heh. many of us (i think)are tsundere-moe.

  • December 3, 2007 at 11:04 amAle

    Likewise, the vast majority of people who bring genetic defects in to this are doing little besides arm-waving and usually have little to none actual knowledge about the issue, as the risk increase between first cousins is almost negligible, and anything further away than that is not worth mentioning at all. People could take a more oppen-minded approach to the issue, as there is actually nothing wrong with it, once we actually got to the core of the issue.

    So you think that I’m taking a narrow minded approach or arm waving simply because I said that as far as I know (which I never said it was a lot) children born out of first cousin couples have a higher chance of genetical disorders?

    I have no problem with first cousins marrying, not even a little bit. I’m very liberal socially, and not even from the US. But there is a slighty higher risk afaik due to the fact that since the people are related they could have the same disease. Correct me if I’m wrong and I’ll listen to someone who is more documented than me on the issue happily, but don’t judge me. That’s unfair if you don’t know my beliefs.

  • December 3, 2007 at 3:04 pmGP

    I don’t think he meant to come down on you Ale, just like how I said it’s illegal due to the genetic problems it could bring. But first cousins aside, 2nd and 3rd are a non-issue.

    The whole debate came up from the way Canvas2 ends. And many other anime shows have a situation where “cousins” fall in love. Kaze no Stigma is like that, and others probably if I bothered to look for more. But what I brought up about it is that although they say they’re cousins in the shows, they NEVER break it down and tell you if they’re first, seconed or so on. they could be very distant “cousins” but still be cousins either way.

    I understand how many probably find this sick, though I like a few in here, am also open-minded about the whole thing, if they’re 2nd cousins or more distant, then it’s a non-issue to me. At first cousins it might be a bit weird at first, but again, nothing like say, a mom and son or brother and sister being together.

  • December 4, 2007 at 3:33 amCooKie

    amazing ep, must say the story’s setting up for a good finale; hope it doesn’t fall flat lol

    @GP
    with an apparent winner in sight glad the Miyako fans have stopped jumping on you man,
    the way things were going the past few weeks I thought you’d call on other Kei fans and form the “KKKei” lol

  • December 4, 2007 at 5:29 amgolthin

    I did some checking about the gamplay and whoever said that the novel was linear and that the player has not descision making was not correct. Here is an entry about the gameplay from the game.

    “The gameplay requires little interaction from the player as most of the duration of the game is spent on simply reading the text that will appear on the screen; this text represents either dialogue between the various characters, or the inner thoughts of the protagonist. Every so often, the player will come to a “DESCISION POINT” where he or she is given the chance to choose from options that are displayed on the screen, typically two to three at a time. During these times, gameplay pauses until a choice is made that furthers the plot in a specific direction, depending on which choice the player makes. There are four main plot lines that the player will have the chance to experience, one for each of the heroines in the story. The stories for Miyako and Kei are available in Ef: The First Tale.”

    That make me think that the outcome of the game depends on the player descision like many games of their type, unlike what somebody said before.

  • December 4, 2007 at 6:30 amGP

    @Golthin

    Yeah, but I think what everyone means is that the way the show is going, it’s fallowing the Miyako path and that it’s a pretty much done deal. I don’t think they have any detailed path information for the two games. At least I know wikipedia doesn’t.

    I’d like to see how each plot line goes. Though with this info I guess it’s anyones guess as to how the anime could end now. But I think that, as with any eroge visual novel, the girl the guy has sex with is the girl that he ends up with. So yeah, it’s pretty much a done deal from the looks of it.

    @CooKie

    Hhaha, no way man, I wasn’t going to take it to that sorta level. I like the show, and I like Kei, but I also don’t hate Miyako (I just don’t feel sorry for her, that little bit with her parents just didn’t effect me), so all I was doing was pointing out that Kei isn’t a cold hearted bitch. A bit lost in her emotions and so on, but hey, no one is perfect imo.

  • December 4, 2007 at 6:42 pmSkyfall

    There really are not “paths” to choose from in ef. While there are some selection points, the story is quite linear in its structure, and you can not change the ending.
    Show Spoiler ▼

    Those would be the first two “main plotlines:”, the ones who are touched upon in the First Tale, and the ones the whole Kei/Miyako/Hiro/Kyousuke deal is based upon. It is best not to think of EF as a regular visual novel, because despite having choices to make, there is only one ending to reach. (following image optional, as i am not sure about your policy regarding linking to images)
    Show Spoiler ▼

    The other two “main plotlines” are Chihiro/Renji and Mizuki/Kuze … neither of the two plotlines are touched upon in ef: the First Tale, so even the game players can’t predict how the Chihiro/Renji relationship will develop and end. Both of these two storylines will be presented in ef: the Later tale, which is to be released in may 2008. ”

    The second comment was regarding the whole issue about cousins marrying and the *gasp* huge chance of genetic defects it brings (though i have no idea how that discussion got spawned in ef discussion)

  • December 4, 2007 at 6:49 pmSkyfall

    @Ale

    I was not referring to you specifically, sorry if my post seemed to imply so, as that was never my intention. The fact you are willing to listen about the issue alone implies you are not close-minded :) As far as genetics and cousin marriages go, and the oh so dreaded chance for increased genetic defects … here are some actual numbers.

    A child born between first cousins has approximately 1.3% – 2.7% increased risk chance to have some sort of genetic defect. Add it to the roughly 3% base chance (though some claim this to be closer to 4%) that any couple has, and you end up roughly with 4%-6% (5%-7% if we take 4% as the base for any couple) risk chance. Is the increase noticeable ? yes it is. Is it anywhere near big enough to start carrying a banner against it ? No it is not. Things like genetic counseling and monitoring can determine actual risk factors, but as far as the general census of genetic scientists go on this one, additional genetic counseling for first cousins, while possibly beneficial, is not really required nor necessarily requested.

    The increased risk chance is more of a statistic one than actually serious trouble. It is basically an urban legend (fairly popular at that) that such an union somehow is “wrong”. Modern genetics say otherwise. (Why do i never see anyone complaining about women 40 years of age (and older) giving birth , while the risk chance then is around 6%-8%, and keeps raising steadily past the age of 40 ? :))

    Though i don’t think any of this applies to ef anyway, but one thing i don’t like is people spreading misinformation :)

  • December 5, 2007 at 12:13 amEh

    Hiro and Miyako have only one thing in common and that’s the fact that they lack “colour” in their life, which they supply to each other. Otherwise, they’re fairly different people, considering Miyako is a delinquent who is essentially completely alone whereas Hiro is a hard working manga artist who _was_ alone in the past but now is surrounded by friends. She’s so spontaneous and random that it helps kill the building stress that Hiro has been dealing with in the form of deadlines, school, and tendonitis. Miyako’s just glad that she met someone that would never forget her, since she’s sort of been alone for most of her life.

    Also, sex = slut m i rite?

    Second also, haha, Kei got owned in the face.

  • December 5, 2007 at 2:42 amSkyfall

    Also, sex = slut m i rite?

    Wrong.
    Slut = someone (usually refers to females) who engages in sexual relationships with multiple partners on a regular basis/ casually.

    Now apply this to our situation and see how ridiculous it is to think of Miyako as anything even remotely resembling the definition.

  • December 5, 2007 at 6:27 amAle

    I think Kei will be fine in the end anyway, GP. She has someone who really cares for her after all.

  • December 5, 2007 at 6:38 amjho

    The past couple of episodes have been really crazy. Should be a very good finish.

  • December 5, 2007 at 4:00 pmAle

    Wow, all the posts came back!

    I see Skyfall, thanks for the info.

  • December 5, 2007 at 10:48 pmLan

    For some reason – I don’t feel bad for Kei

  • December 6, 2007 at 2:00 amFlameStrike

    Ah it may just be me, but I think the amount of Miyako x Hiro develpoment was lacking, I’m all for the Miyako x Hiro pairing but I don’t like rushed development like that. It gave me Ayu x Yuuichi flash backs were Ayu and Yuuichi were suddenly makeing out, except they had 19ish episodes and didn’t get in bed. Still the Renji and Chihiro parts were great, I know it was a little fast too but they kind of made up for it by fast forwarding the amount of time they spent in a few sences. I’m enjoying the Chihiro and Renji parts just as much as the Miyako Kei Hirono triangle so it was fine with me.

  • December 6, 2007 at 3:17 amScytale

    Has anyone noticed that Chihiro in the kimono resembles Akyu from the Touhou series? Get rid of the eyepatch, and place a flower in her hair and she and Akyu would looked frighteningly similar.

  • February 16, 2008 at 11:34 amRazziell

    Awesome! Hiro x Miyako love that couple!