「嘘と強がりの向こう側」 (Uso to Tsuyo Gari no Mukou-gawa)
“On the Other Side of Lies and Façade”

The climax of the Kuro arc is here, as Iri-mama arrives to clear everything up.

Kuro vs Miyu

Kuro versus Miyu was more of that Prisma Illya (and Fate in general)-style battle porn. I would call it sakuga, but the production quality has always been a bit high, and their use of CG was more pronounced this episode since they were pulling off so many crazy action moves that it became needed. The state of anime CG is getting so much better that I really didn’t mind. Mostly I just leaned back and let the action flow over me.

Here’s the funny part: I was rooting for Kuro. Not because I wanted her to win (don’t hurt Miyu!), but because I love a clever cheater like Kuro, and because Miyu cheesed me off with her “Saber has better stats” comment. Stats aren’t everything, Miyu! You should know that a weaker fighter can win if they’re more clever. Aren’t you watching ALDNOAH.ZERO? Erh, wait.

Mostly though, the early part was fun for the action lover. (Also, this.) The only thing that (further) hinted at Kuro’s whole deal was an interesting one. Kuro described herself as a cheater who could realize her victory without knowing how – in effect, instead of going from A through B to get to C, she could go from A to C without even knowing what B was. Miyu’s attempt to circumvent this by constantly changing what A was clever, but I found myself thinking of another Illya-associated magical thing that would allow one to defy rules like that. Though actually, I remember reading somewhere that the grail actually needs to know the method by which the wish is to be fulfilled; for example, a “save the entire world” wish made by Kiritsugu, who (in the Fate/stay night & Fate/Zero timeline) believed in sacrificing the few for the benefit of the many, would be granted through sacrifice. (Or maybe that was just the tainted grail. Correct me if I’m wrong on that, sports fans.) So maybe that was off, but it certainly gave the “wish” feeling, and that was what we needed to see.

Iri-mama is a Mage!

Spin-offs can come in many flavors, but two of the main ones are: 1) Take the same characters in the same general world/setting and change what happens, and 2) Take the same characters and put them in a completely different setting and see what happens. When I first came across the Prisma Illya manga, it felt like it was more the latter. Not in the magic system – even Ruby existed in the original timeline, in Fate/hollow ataraxia – but in the tone. Prisma Illya seemed far more focused on flashy Nanoha-style magical explosions and light adventure, less on soul-rending evil and crushing despair. And Iskander. (More Iskander would be fine though.) So I was never quite sure whether things like the Holy Grail even existed in this reality.

Then Iri-mama whipped out the magic and clobbered Kuro. And then Illya, because fair is fair. Scary! (In a good way.) Also, that answers that. Not that it hadn’t been hinted at – not just with Kuro’s existence, but going back to Illya’s huge mana reserves and how Ruby picked her in the first place – but that was the moment that it became conclusive. Shelve this under many worlds theory people. We’re playing with the Second True Magic, diving into Zelretch’s realms, etc. etc. Sorry, I got lost on the Type-Moon wiki a few times. I don’t suggest it, your productivity will disappear for days. You’ve been warned.

The Holy Grail War & the Einzbern Family

In this week’s gratuitous bath scene, we learn about the Holy Grail War all over again. For those that missed it: It was still happening, but the Einzberns opted out, first of the Mage Association many years ago, and then out of existence, probably with Kiritsugu’s help. That’s not confirmed yet, but come on, it’s his style. Plus Iri said he gave her the choice? Probably with his quasi-reality marble and his trusty Thompson Contender. Damn you Type-Moon wiki! I’m not supposed to remember these things!

Which is heartening, to be honest. I understand the power of grand dreams, but any dream that requires the sacrifice of innocent lives isn’t a dream worth having. So many people in the Fate worlds are twisted by the search for the Root, I like that someone finally kept their head on straight and said no! A child’s life should not be sacrificed for such nonsense!

Illya’s Choice

So Kuro was the Holy Grail. The question remains: Why did Iri seal her? Why did she not let Kuro remain herself (instead of giving the body over to Illya) and let her live her life as a normal girl? My guess is A) she couldn’t, and B) she wanted to give Illya a choice. On the former, recall that Illya was actually as older than Shirou in Fate/stay night, as shown by her existing at all in Fate/Zero. Would she have been able to have a normal life if she was aging noticeably slower than her peers? To say nothing of the otherworldly knowledge she (well, Kuro) would have had.

But I think it was the choice that Iri wanted to give her daughter, of whether to accept the grail – or more precisely, the part of the grail that was her – or to reject it. And Illya made her choice – the grail be damned, she decided to save Kuro.

Kuro’s Wish

Much as been said about who was in the right, Kuro of Illya. The answer is “Both, and neither”, and I’m not getting into it further because the whole relationship is complex. What I loved was the end, where Kuro, as she was disappearing, finally revealed her wish:

“I want family. I want friends. I want to live a normal, everyday life. But…more than that…more than anything…I don’t want to disappear! I just…I want to live!”

In the end, their wishes were the same, and Illya gave her just the push she needed to realize that she could make her wish come true. I don’t have a point or a theme to draw on. It was really just a touching moment. I watched it like three times. Good on you, Kuro.

Looking Ahead – Sister Fun

My question remains the same: where will this cour end? With a ton of manga yet to go and no rush evident in the pacing (thankfully), the 2wei manga won’t be finished. And with a silly episode in the plans for next week, it’s hard to know what kind of ending we’ll get if this ends at ten episodes like many are expecting. (Manga readers, watch the spoilers. By which I mean don’t say them. We’ll find out together dammit.) Silver Link isn’t usually an anime-original-ending kind of studio, so I feel like four more episodes of fluff or a cliffhanger are in the works. And somehow, I’m not sure we’ll get lucky enough and get a season three. We can hope.

tl;dr: @StiltsOutLoud – The Kuro saga comes to an end as Iri-mama steps back onto the stage. It’s a Fate world after all #prismaillya 06

Random thoughts:

  • Miyu just realized that Kuro is their first enemy who can think. Uh, duh? Most people have to deal with enemies who can think. Don’t get tripped up by that.
  • If Kuro was the one born to be the grail, where did Illya come from? Wait, dumb question – Kuro is just the sealed memories that developed into a different personality by divergent experiences. They’re both Illya. That’s why Iri-mama calls them both Illya-chan.
  • “Is she actually an illegitima–” Sharp guess, Shirou. Good punch, Sella!
  • Speaking of, if there wasn’t a Fuyuki City fire in this world, how did Kiritsugu pick up Shirou? Stop kidnapping children, Kiri!
  • The episode ends with Illya going all brocon over Shirou, wanting Kuro to back off…and then that first preview pic. Request denied. LET THE SHIROU GAMES BEGIN ANEW!

Check out my blog about storytelling and the novel I’m writing at stiltsoutloud.com. The last four posts: You have to sell free, Different answers, and Compromise, Control.

Full-length images: 39.



End Card


  1. Poor Ilya, her good deed has caused her to gain one more love rival.

    And for Shirou, lol judging from the preview, I wonder if there is a “good ending route” for him in this story, if he becomes a lolicon. If so then the show should be renamed “My little Illya-chan can’t be this cute!”

  2. Why did she not let Kuro remain herself (instead of giving the body over to Illya) and let her live her life as a normal girl?

    As far as anyone’s been able to tell, Iris had no reason to believe that the sealed memories would become an entirely different person. If they ever came unsealed, she likely thought they would just become part of Illya’s memories, and Illya would still be Illya. It’s not like Iris implanted a new personality into Illya’s body or anything: Illya was still a baby when those memories were sealed, and her first memories start after that. The Illya we know simply developed as a person from that point.

    Really, if it wasn’t for a pretty unanticipatable combination of the cards, the weird magic events in Fuyuki City, Illya being recruited to be a magical girl, and Illya’s own wish to still be an ordinary girl, Kuro would never have split off into a separate person.

    1. I believe it’s more of a case of “rebooting” Illya for lack of a better term. Homunculi are self aware at an early age (Iri was only nine years old during Fate/Zero) and the flashback itself implies that “Illya” was already self-aware as a baby. So she would have knowledge of mages and the Holy Grail War. But her parents wanted a normal life for her so they sealed that part of her and let her live a life with no knowledge of the magic world.

      That’s pretty much the biggest source of Kuro’s resentment of Illya and why she depises being called a fake. She was the “first” Illya but Magical girl Illya took over the life she would have had.

    2. This is also one of the issues I had towards the first season, as I mentioned before.

      They clearly show this episode that Iri is aware of Illya’s powers, and is keeping it a secret from her. But they removed or changed most of those scenes in the first season. Instead they replaced the “are you afraid of your own power” struggle that Illya is going through (and ties closely with the existence of Kuro) with the more generic “do you want to help your friend”.

      I think this whole situation would have more impact if they kept those scenes, to show how Iri is also emotionally affected by her choice.

      1. i imagine those were excluded only because they weren’t sure if they were going to be able to adapt a second season. they probably didn’t want to take any risks by including things that foreshadow future events and leaving plot holes that might never get resolved in anime form.

    3. Good to know, thanks all.


      I don’t think that would have mattered. That was a year ago, so I didn’t remember the specific wording Iri chose for that scene, just the general jist of it. Unless anyone watched that episode right before this one – as in just the past week, not before the season – most won’t remember the minor details.

      1. I understand that. This is just more nitpicking on my part.

        They have been faithfully adapting everything else, so it stood out for me when a detail like that was excluded.

  3. Well this episode sums up a good chunk of missing parts and also finishes (generally speaking) setting Fate Kaleid firmly in the FSN universe. Will be curious to see what happens from here on out, but considering Kuro is the Grail it’s a good bet someone wanting to use her will be making an appearance soon.

    Also the ending with Kuro joining the family, had good giggle at Leysritt looking at her like she’s a new puppy before trying to bait her with Pockey. Not to mention Mama Iri coming out of nowhere and crash landing a car (without a hint of damage) before unleashing constructive punishment on her recalcitrant daughters. Fate Kaleid may not be unique, but it’s sure never boring 😛

  4. Oh yes, I forgot to mention…

    In the end, their wishes were the same, and Illya gave her just the push she needed to realize that she could make her wish come true. I don’t have a point or a theme to draw on. It was really just a touching moment. I watched it like three times. Good on you, Kuro.

    I have probably read that part of chapter 10 the most out of any segment of the entire Prisma Illya manga. It never fails to get to me.

  5. wow Kuro gonna go full force on Shiro.. watch out Illya!!

    “Kuro described herself as a cheater who could realize her victory without knowing how – in effect, instead of going from A through B to get to C, she could go from A to C without even knowing what B was” it reminded me of the Einzbern sorcery trait (AKA: Holy-Grail, wish-granting, or “wishcraft”) .. but it applies to magic.

    The description of the Holy Grial is spot on , it can grant wishes as long as you know how (iow: is not “all knowing”), is more like giving you untold amounts of energy to grant you a “wish” the way you know how to realize it. (thats ofcourse the “public” usage of the grail)

    About Miyu’s comment about Kuro being the first enemy that is able to think… well they fought thoughtless berserkers so far, for them is the first “thinking ” enemy… thou i dunno if the translation is 100% correct… it would be more precise to say that Kuro is the first “cunning” enemy.

    Mama iri is a mage… well not a surprise really.. back in S1 she seemed to be aware that the “seal” on Illya was breaking.

    “the Einzbern are no more” … wow that gave me the chills… can we assume that fate cannon and prisma cannon run parallel till 10 years ago in which Iri and Kiri went rogue to save their daughter? gives a totally new context to all the time Iri and Kiritsugu spend abroad.

    PS: haha Irisviel still a danger while driving! somethings just cant change!

    PS2: ok i noticed something odd… Miyu’s face when Iri mentioned the holy grail war… she seemed shocked… they never explained to her the war, rigth? IIRC it never happened in Prisma cannon , she shouldnt be aware of it. Even Rin and Luvia refer to it as a “large scale ritual” (and Rin was supposed to be one of the founding families)… mebe im just forgetting the episode they explained all this to Miyu . lol.

  6. Though actually, I remember reading somewhere that the grail actually needs to know the method by which the wish is to be fulfilled; for example, a “save the entire world” wish made by Kiritsugu, who (in the Fate/stay night & Fate/Zero timeline) believed in sacrificing the few for the benefit of the many, would be granted through sacrifice. (Or maybe that was just the tainted grail. Correct me if I’m wrong on that, sports fans.)

    It doesn’t require the method so much as the means. The Grail doesn’t actually grant miracles. That, as I understand it, is one of the things that prevents it from actually reaching the state of being a form of True Magic. If you make a wish using the Grail, it must find the means to grant that wish somewhere in the world. That is why Illya’s wish to defeat Saber Alter caused her to use the Archer card: those were the means on hand. Her wish to live when attacked by True Assassin caused her to duplicate Ruby’s idea of a “Lyrical Radical Genocide” to destroy everything around her.

    Now, the corrupted Grail would only grant wishes by causing harm, as I recall. So a wish to save the world would kill people. Possibly everyone in the world, if the Grail can find the means to do so. The world would thereby be “safe.” Nobody left to cause it harm. But it has always kind of acted like a stupid computer program that gives you what you ask for rather than what you want. I don’t really think it’s worth all the effort people keep putting into getting it.

    1. Well Gigamesh and Kerie were discussing in the Fate/Zero novel how the grant wishes part of the Grail was just bait for idiots to participate in the War, since the Grail is connected to source of all knowledge is a possibility to have your wish granted.

  7. If the season is just full of this cast of characters pulling slice of life fluff hijinks, I am totally OK with that. Who needs overarching plot development when you have Ilya, Kuro and Miyu… kissing all the girls and getting mad at each other.

    Ok, there’s plenty of DxD ‘plot’ too from Rin, Luvia, Maids, Irisviel. I suppose something will happen… but the crux of this show has and will always be the relationships between the girls (and ensuing battle porn). Regular plot be damned!

    Spoiler Alert
  8. @Stilts… If I remember well the 5th War Grail was corrupt and everything it could do was murder!
    Want world peace?
    KILL ALL THE HUMANS! would be the answer…
    Something like that…

    1. @Airas

      Yes, the grail got corrupted during the third grail war in the original timeline, which means it was still corrupt during the fourth (FZ) and fifth (FSN) wars. Regardless it still needs the means, but it’s the difference between an uncorrupted grail granting Kiritsugu’s wish by killing the few to save the many, and a corrupted grail granting it by killing everyone in the most gruesome way possible. The general idea is the same, but the corrupted one is the monkey paw that always goes horribly wrong.

  9. Let´s be honest here, many families of magi are completely insane, we just have hear Tokiomi saying crap about how killing each other in the next Grail War would be a great happiness as magi to her daugthers, just for the sake of Akasha, that knowledge that will never share with anyone because it goes against their laws. The fact that the Magic Association promotes this sickening abosession with knowledge tells us they are axactly the good guys either.

      1. Well Shirou in the original fate stay night was without a doubt a guy, he cared nothing for the Gril and thought it was best that such a thing never existed in the first place.

      2. Well Shirou in the original fate stay night was without a doubt a guy

        Well, yes, I cannot argue with that. Shirou is most definitely a male.

        he cared nothing for the Gril

        That is a surprise. With all the cooking he does, he has never used a grill before?

        I’m just kidding! But those typos were too funny to pass up. XD

  10. seriously… the action porn in this episode is top notched!

    To actually see the tactical dance like fighting style of Archer in loli action brings tears to my eyes. The Fate Fanboy in me is pleased beyond words

  11. I’m a little confused here…so is Kuro the embodiment of the Holy Grail who was sealed into Illya? Or was Kuro the part of Illya that became the Holy Grail and was sealed but developed into a persona of her own over the years of watching things through Illya herself? The way Illya actually started to see things from Kuro’s perspective when she was unconscious almost made it look like Illya was actually the fake one (or maybe the byproduct of sealing Kuro)…

    1. Kuro and Illya started as the same person. The memories that became Kuro + the grail were sealed away, thinking that would give Illya a normal life. Kuro developing her own personality and taking corporeal form was an unexpected situation.

  12. https://randomc.net/image/Fate%20kaleid%20liner%20Prisma%20Illya/Fate%20kaleid%20liner%20Prisma%20Illya%20Zwei!%20-%2006%20-%20Large%2032.jpg
    Prisma Illya: Where making peace with your enemies is making out with them.

    So ends the first part of Zwei. When I first read this part I honestly didn’t think it’d be this dramatic. I knew Silver Link would deliver a great battle but they were able to balance the emotions without being too overwrought so props to them. And Iri’s arrival was great, what mom can enter the scene crashing a car and beating up magical girls while smiling?

    Next episode will be the cooking chapter, which to me was the funniest part of Zwei. I hope they will be able to get the comic timing right.

  13. As far as I can tell, they’re both real.

    I believe Ilya was born/created complete with Holy Grail abilities & memories. Those got sealed, and eventually become Kuro. Ilya grows up with her origin unbeknownst to her Humans normally forget everything under age 3 regardless (no real loss). Season 1: Magic girl shennanigans occur, seal gets weakened, Holy Grail powers/memories manifest (Kuro). Season 2: Kuro is physically created from a magic conflux event.

    A rough timeline looks like this:

    Pre-season 1
    Ilya was created / born, made to become the holy grail.
    Holy Grail Powers / Memories got sealed.

    Ilya grows up as a ‘normal’ girl, no magic memories.

    Season 1
    Prisma Ilya events happen, seal weakens,
    Holy Grail Memories / Kuro begins manifesting in times of extreme danger
    Ilya not aware when Kuro appears.

    Season 2
    Magic mud event occurs
    Kuro manifests into seperate body

    I could be wrong or misinterpreting, but end result is a happy family. . . with hijinks.

  14. Stilts:
    I love trickster characters too. In fighting games, they’re called mix-ups for their unpredictability.

    “Stats aren’t everything, Miyu! You should know”
    True that stats only one aspect! Know thyself and know thy enemy. She fails at the latter. I disagree on the second half of your statement… Miyu’s strong, but she’s still inexperienced and naive. So it is both fun and fitting to her character that she doesn’t know, but is learning one step at a time through the school of hard knocks.

    In high level competition, the fight is done in the minds of the players as much as the execution of events. More often than not, victory goes to the one that gets inside the other’s head, knows their expectations, thinking and reactions… and exploits it!

    Saber’s technically stronger head on. Archer does not fight head on, and I love watching them play with each other’s thoughts. Miyu’s never on equal mental footing, as Kuro dances around her both physically and her mental expectations. That’s real skill, that I looove watching.

    Code Geass’s Lelouch and No Game No Life’s Kuuhaku pulled the same shennanigans too, with a touch of the dramatic. Aldnoah Zero’s MC style is just more vulcan 🙂

  15. You’re reading way too much into Kuro knowing the method to victory.

    Archer’s skillset includes the ability to know how to win from experience:

    Eye of the Mind (True) (心眼(真)) is a heightened capacity for observation, refined through experience.

    B: Capable of calm analysis of battle conditions even when in danger and deduce an appropriate course of action after considering all possibilities to escape from a predicament. So long there is even a 1% chance of a comeback, this ability greatly improves the chances of winning.

    Giorno Giovanna
  16. Mostly though, the early part was fun for the action lover. (Also, this.)

    In this week’s gratuitous bath scene

    Since you seem to like both of those scenes so much, I will leave you with this official art. Be warned, though, it is INSANELY NSFW.

    Although, knowing the perverted Stilts, you will probably click it anyway. XD

  17. Love that Irisviel kept that badass car of hers. Also, Illya’s dynamic entry in the fight between Miyu and Kuro to stop them felt like something Homura would pull.

    Either way, I liked that they gave us rather clear and logical answers for Kuro’s existence and this show’s place in the Fate canon – it generally makes sense, given what you’d know beforehand. Magic A is Magic A in this universe, after all, and I like the consistency. So now that Kuro’s (or Chloe) an actual part of Illya’s family (not sure how’d you count her, what do you call a living, seperate, older personality of yourself?), let the shenanigans begin!

    And yeah, I think it’s pretty clear this season won’t end on a rushjob or anything. Though looking at the OP, I am expecting another fight (probably serving as the climax). Not sure where that fight is in the manga though, I hope they weren’t being jerks and put that in there just to tease us.

    1. Kuro’s cover hasn’t changed even though she lives with Illya now. She’s Chloe von Einzbern, Illya’s cousin from Germany. Their new relationship dynamic should be covered hopefully next episode.

      As for Zwei, it has 3 parts when you don’t include the comedy filler. Kuro we already covered. Then next is Bazett which the OP has graciously spoiled for us. The last arc will probably not be covered judging by the pacing of the anime, which is unfortunate since it is the most epic part of Zwei.

      1. Nah, I wasn’t talking about her cover, but rather her existence when it comes to Illya. What should she regard her as, her sister? Clone? Mirror image? Other self? Just semantics probably, but still.

        Anyway, looking forward to their new dynamic.

      2. Well, if they rush it and cut out the beach episode, they could probably get the whole thing done.

        Ep 7 – The whole older sister thing
        Ep 8 – Bazett
        Ep 9 & 10 – Final battle

        They could probably do the beach episode as an OVA…I didn’t forget anything did I?

      3. @Dvalinn: they mostly tend to go with the “sisters” approach between themselves, although there’s still some weirdness in their relationship that makes it hard to properly define. In some ways they seem much closer than family, yet in others they act like rivals who argue and chase the other out of their rooms.

  18. cruiser2710
    1. Sry, i cant come with a Storyline this time.

      The First pictures just say “Fire and Ice dance” in my Mind, but then the Bath scene just cut through my Picture inside my mind…

      Right now, it dont made “click” in my Mind…

      1. Saber is the Water/Ice Element Sword. With snow particle or something like that
        Archer ist the Fire, the flame of Acrobatic.

        But then, i am unable to combine it with the slower and talking bath sequence

      2. https://randomc.net/image/Fate%20kaleid%20liner%20Prisma%20Illya/Fate%20kaleid%20liner%20Prisma%20Illya%20Zwei!%20-%2006%20-%20Large%2021.jpg
        What? We would not get these Big Boobs like Mama?
        Nope!, Your just a Holy Grail Body Host. So no Boobies like Mommy
        Wuahhhh!!! *Snief*
        But, but.. but i wanna have Boobies! or Kuro is Sad
        Objection!. I should have the bigger ones, or else she would steal the Boy from me!
        What? I swear i would not do it.
        I dont trust you either, Kuro
        Hey, no talking from the Sideline
        Fine, One-san. I know a Secret that give you bigger Boobs
        Really? If you tell me the Secret, i would not kill you
        Ohm, there is someone getting exited… Alright…
        The Kiss of Boobies Growing attack!!
        Oni-san. Did my Boobies grown bigger?
        Ohm, ahh. What did you say?
        You still just Flat…Aua… aehm, grown a little. Yes yes…
        Here, a chocolate stick for you. to grown into bigger ones. Thats my Secret.
        Thats, for being Nice to Kuro!!!.. Never ever! You just should DIE!!!

  19. Well this episode played out pretty much how I expected. Big fight, someone FINALLY gives us expedition on Kuro’s backround and it all ends with a cheesy resolution. Gets a pretty meh response from me. Feels like nothing more than a waste of time on cruddy melodrama.

    Speaking of which this whole Kuro situation reminds me a lot of Yukine from Noragami. His actions were completely reprehensible and made me hate him the majority of his arc. But one thing I liked about his arc is that when he finally atones for his actions he openly admits that he was wrong. That everything he did was indeed bad. And that’s what made it work for me. Even if his angst was somewhat understandable given his situation in the end he still admitted to his wrong doings. Even if I found him annoying THAT’S what i like to see.

    Compare that the here? It’s everyone else who is in the wrong while Kuro is just a sad misunderstood existence. She makes absouletly no attempts to reach out to anyone even going as far to complain about “No one understanding her” which is a line I particularly find annoying with most characters like this. No freaking duh no one understands you since you refused to open up about anything this entire time! Why would anyone feel sorry for you when you tried to murder them with no explanation? Why would anyone trust you when you make it pretty obvious you are hiding your true intentions? I really don’t get it. I think the story should have at least shown a lot more of Kuro’s inner struggle to at least make her actions more understandable early on. Because i REALLY hate it when you have an annoying character complaining about how no one understands them but the audience is not really given any reason to sympathize them till the “resolution” episode. Kuro has done nothing but be a self serving prick. If she had actually done some nice things or shown she has could be selfless during this arc then MAYBE I would have cared about her situation.

    But after certain point when a character acts like this for so long you start to just question “Alright, can you PLEASE just tell us your tragic backstory already so we can move on?”. It’s a matter of testing the audience’s patience (again just look at how much people hated Yukine and got tired of his behavior during his arc). Personally even now I felt nothing for Kuro in this episode. Sure this episode explains her behavior but having to sit through her crap for this long wasn’t worth it imo.

    She didn’t even admit that what she did was wrong or apologize to IIlya for what she did to her. Because as I said apparently everyone else was in the wrong therefore she has no need to apologize. Honestly that’s the whole issue right there. Just Kuro saying “I’m sorry” would have made me more lenient on her. But since we didn’t even get THAT much from her I suppose I can just be glad that this unbalanced scale of “who is wrong or not” is finally over.

    1. I have to agree and also think it’s quite hypocritical of characters to act like that; say that no one could possibly understand them when they won’t even let people know what their problem is to begin with. Even if we the viewers come to understand through inner monologues, that’s only for us viewers, not the other characters, so it doesn’t really help the story. And as you said, such things only make everyone else look like the “bad guy(s)”.

      Even Ilya came to realize that what she said before (wanting to go back to a normal life) was thoughtless and hurtful, confronted Kuro (and Miyu) and admitted it, and tried to atone for it.

      I also felt the transition was a bit weird. It goes from an epic battle between Miyu and Kuro (fully garbed), then Ilya coming in trying to apologize and set things right…then suddenly Iri comes flying in in her car and comedically owns Kuro right after…then it goes right back to the serious talking…in the baths…

    2. sigh well, this is one of the things that doesnt make zwei(or prisma illya as whole) not as good as the manga.

      thing is, the anime is sort of emphasizing and highlighting the more dramatic aspect, trying to force you to feel for the characters… meanwhile the manga focuses a bit more on the comedic and mystery aspect.

      though its not actually that the anime is changing what happened, its just that their emphasis is a bit off to say the least.
      in the manga as I said weeks ago, kuro wasnt made any sympathetic. sure there were some comments, but overall kuro wasnt placed in any sympathetic light, mostly they just highlighted the mystery on kuro’s existence as well as her mischievous streak.

      basically, kuro was more on being made entertaining with her devious personality that would lead the fans to get around her despite how she wants to kill illya. a lot of people actually liked her before they even knew what she really was, they liked how competent and shrewd she was compared to other characters.
      she wasnt supposed to be a character that was pitied… actually, even during this scene, it was more on making the connection and bridging the fate series with you learning that kuro’s actually the illya from the original series, rather than on how tough kuro’s life has been.

      as a whole though, prisma illya was initially made for showing and portraying the other sides in fate series that were just gleamed upon or just mentioned. mostly it was there to show the other awesome sides, like how powerful archer could have been.
      actually, it was more or less after this one, where prisma illya really grew out on making its own steps rather than relying solely on the source materials, so basically its supposed to be after this one where it really shows its uniqueness like SoL themes and starts focusing on making the characters their own.

      so if you dont feel pity for her, then thats fine, or well that was supposed to be the case
      the anime just gives a different focus, not entirely wrong, but its not quite the theme that the scenes were all about, which is why im not quite that fond of the anime even if the scenes are “accurate”.

  20. Best. Mom. Ever.
    (Even if she effectively forced a split personality on her daughter – and turned it up to the 11, effectively creating a twin sister)

    Also, the battle scene was so over the top… It’s like watching Pokemons doing Mortal Kombat moves!

  21. On the former, recall that Illya was actually as older than Shirou in Fate/stay night, as shown by her existing at all in Fate/Zero.
    As far as I know, Illya should be around 4 years old (or maybe even younger) in Fate/Zero, while Shirou is 6 or 7 when Kiritsugu adopts him, so Shirou is still older.

    1. She is definitely older than Shirou. The first time this was mentioned is in FSN (Visual Novel). Ilya is eight in Fate/Zero. The first scene in FZ (when she is born) plays eight years before the 4th War starts. Shirou was six or seven at the end of the war.

  22. Just some clarification. The Holy Grail War never happened in the Kaliedverse or more accurately Kiritsugu and Iris what would’ve been the first one before it can begin. Which means the Einzberns did not cooperate with the the Tousaka and Makiri/Matou clans in their pursuit of the Root. Hence Rin’s ignorance. What allowed Kuro to exist was not just the Grail but made possible through Third Magic.

    Illya here is not an 18 year old Homunculus but a ten going eleven year old girl in this universe. The Grail personality is something the Einzberns has been working for generations and Illya was to be their Key to the Ritual.

    Iris thought she erased it but it only produced the current Illya personality to protect herself. Basically Illya had a Dissociative Identity Disorder. The original personality would show up during very stressful life threatening situations until the Grail granted both Illya and Kuro’s wishes.

    1. So, then how they explain us then. How Illya used the first time Archer and do the fighting in Season 1? Oh, it was Kuro not wanna die?

      There are some gaps. But it is okay for me, Anime Magic…

      1. Illya can’t deal with the stress and freaking out hence Kuro had to step up.

        Remember Illya asked when she transformed to Archerko how is it possible? It wasn’t the Illya personality that asked that.


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